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December 18-20 Winter Storm Discussion


Chicago WX

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Great post by OHWx putting it more into layman's terms than I probably could. When I talk weather with a lot of friends and folks I know they just stare at me like "what are you talking about?"

I do have some worries the building cold and the jet streak relaxing could bring energy out in pieces which is why I said I'm not ready to guarantee a big snow storm just yet. Everything on the board that shows up though is hard to ignore and screams a good snow for someone sooner than later though.

Just don't jump off the edge guys and gals, we will get our chances somewhere, this Winter WILL be more of a Winter than last....

Words to live by :thumbsup:

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Great post by OHWx putting it more into layman's terms than I probably could. When I talk weather with a lot of friends and folks I know they just stare at me like "what are you talking about?"

I do have some worries the building cold and the jet streak relaxing could bring energy out in pieces which is why I said I'm not ready to guarantee a big snow storm just yet. Everything on the board that shows up though is hard to ignore and screams a good snow for someone sooner than later though.

Just don't jump off the edge guys and gals, we will get our chances somewhere, this Winter WILL be more of a Winter than last....

Thanks.

I agree with the bolded. There is still enough that can go wrong at this range, mainly the energy coming out strung out and not spinning up a bigger storm that throws moisture into the cold, that we can't guarantee anything yet.

This would have to be a perfect thread the needle job to end up being a good east coast storm with the lack of strong blocking and troughing over the western US...we'd need enough energy to come out to spin up a good storm, but would need to keep it neutrally tilted until it gets to the Apps or else it cuts through the OV/Lakes. If there is a storm, I'd certainly favor it impacting us with snow over the east coast.

If this comes out as a massive bowling ball, as some have said, this would certainly open up possibilities farther south and east.

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Thanks.

I agree with the bolded. There is still enough that can go wrong at this range, mainly the energy coming out strung out and not spinning up a bigger storm that throws moisture into the cold, that we can't guarantee anything yet.

This would have to be a perfect thread the needle job to end up being a good east coast storm with the lack of strong blocking and troughing over the western US...we'd need enough energy to come out to spin up a good storm, but would need to keep it neutrally tilted until it gets to the Apps or else it cuts through the OV/Lakes. If there is a storm, I'd certainly favor it impacting us with snow over the east coast.

If this comes out as a massive bowling ball, as some have said, this would certainly open up possibilities farther south and east.

Doesn't a West-based -NAO scream Noreaster? This is why I'm being a negative nellie; all the signs seem to point to suppression; most of the models (except the Euro Ensembles, which I guess is good to have on our side), the west based -NAO signal that is being talked about in all the East Coast-oriented forums.

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Doesn't a West-based -NAO scream Noreaster? This is why I'm being a negative nellie; all the signs seem to point to suppression; most of the models (except the Euro Ensembles, which I guess is good to have on our side), the west based -NAO signal that is being talked about in all the East Coast-oriented forums.

Yes and no.

The -NAO is not terribly strong as modeled right now. There should be room for any initial storm to cut north towards the OV/Lakes, and then potentially transferring to the east coast. The best chances for snow in the east are likely in the northern and interior Mid Atlantic along with New England with this system.

If the -NAO continues to come on stronger and the first wave is forced to slow down and track a bit farther south/west I'd be a little bit more worried about the 2nd wave being too suppressed for a good portion of us.

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Yes and no.

The -NAO is not terribly strong as modeled right now. There should be room for any initial storm to cut north towards the OV/Lakes, and then potentially transferring to the east coast. The best chances for snow in the east are likely in the northern and interior Mid Atlantic along with New England with this system.

If the -NAO continues to come on stronger and the first wave is forced to slow down and track a bit farther south/west I'd be a little bit more worried about the 2nd wave being too suppressed for a good portion of us.

Well it is true that the first wave is trending north right now (also trending to be a rainstorm even in the Northwoods of Wisconsin), so I see your point. My only real concern would be a strong -NAO that resulted in 20s and 30s and brown grass for the following week or two. That's not likely to be the case, but you never know.

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it's just so damn messy. Too much junk in Canada and the west. No decent ridge can establish and therefore no decent trough. So it's sloppy and convoluted not too mention the cold air source iis stale polar crap.

If we can get all the scattered energy leading up to this...organized and filed, we might have a shot at a decent event somewhere.

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got one hell of a storm cranking that far east and the 0 850 line is just to my west. You almost have to wonder how suspect that is. But here we go again, with a totally different solution. lol

Well, it's not like we haven't been seeing something like that on previous runs. There's just not a lot of cold air around.

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well I guess if there is any good news for us over here in the OV it's that the euro is hellbent on bringing a low somewhere between the OV and the coast next week. Only queston is whether it runs up the OV. apps, or coastal plain and whether its a jumper, runner, double-barrel, or bomb.....oh, and if there will be any cold air around.

Other than that looks solid :blink:

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