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Upstate NY/North Country + adjacent ON, QC, VT: Heading into December


Alpha5

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Snowing harder now here then it was during the "Winter Storm Warning", if this keeps up overnight, we may end up with a few inches out of this. Roads already covered.

I'm a bit surprised too. Has been snowing moderately here at Delaware Park for a couple of hours I think. Probably already an inch down. Definitely much more than the few flurries they forecast for tonight :-)

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Snowing nicely here in Orchard Park too, and the radar looks pretty good just to our west. Flakes are tiny, but it's definitely accumulating.

I know it hasn't seemed like it recently, but you guys are so lucky to live near the lakes. It's so freakin easy to get a "surprise" inch or two out of basically nothing. Somebody must've sneezed on the other side of the lake.

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Snowing nicely here in Orchard Park too, and the radar looks pretty good just to our west. Flakes are tiny, but it's definitely accumulating.

I know it hasn't seemed like it recently, but you guys are so lucky to live near the lakes. It's so freakin easy to get a "surprise" inch or two out of basically nothing. Somebody must've sneezed on the other side of the lake.

Yeah, I totally agree. We are so spoiled here its not even funny. I see people on the New England board becoming so impatient waiting for it to snow. They are so dependant on a synoptic snowstorm to hit, they have no other sources of snowfall. Sometimes we get surprise events that are huge in lake effect storms. I remember a few times NWS predicting nothing and getting 6+ inches. Lake effect snow forecasting is such a delicate process. But these dime and dink snowfalls definitely contribute to the total snowfall this region receives.

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The New England board has been a very ugly place this season; I can only imagine how bad it's going to be if yet another storm produces rain in Boston.

My personal expectation for the Wednesday/Thursday storm is for a big interior New Egland and adjacent eastern New York event, in spite of what the 00z gfs op is currently showing. I think Boston and a lot of eastern MA may be screwed once again. A lot of people over here will be happy though, IMO.

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The New England board has been a very ugly place this season; I can only imagine how bad it's going to be if yet another storm produces rain in Boston.

My personal expectation for the Wednesday/Thursday storm is for a big interior New Egland and adjacent eastern New York event, in spite of what the 00z gfs op is currently showing. I think Boston and a lot of eastern MA may be screwed once again. A lot of people over here will be happy though, IMO.

Yeah its brutal over there. I am feeling good about this week in terms of synoptic snow for this area. I think that storm has a high likelihood to give us a decent bout ot snow. Going to be a few more days for details into who gets what and when though. Always fun to track and follow these storms though!

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Euro was a nice hit

KALB

THU 00Z 27-DEC  -2.8    -4.8    1021	  60	  97    0.06	 556	 539   
THU 06Z 27-DEC  -3.2    -7.3    1012	  86	 100    0.44	 551	 541   
THU 12Z 27-DEC  -1.9    -4.4    1005	  88	  69    0.40	 543	 540   
THU 18Z 27-DEC  -0.4    -3.5    1001	  86	  98    0.11	 539	 539   
FRI 00Z 28-DEC  -1.6    -5.2    1006	  87	  95    0.11	 539	 535

kuca

THU 00Z 27-DEC  -4.3    -3.2    1018	  74	  97    0.07	 554	 539   
THU 06Z 27-DEC  -4.4    -6.9    1010	  84	  99    0.59	 548	 539   
THU 12Z 27-DEC  -3.6    -6.2    1006	  86	  92    0.11	 542	 537   
THU 18Z 27-DEC  -2.8    -6.3    1006	  87	  98    0.07	 539	 535   
FRI 00Z 28-DEC  -7.1    -7.3    1012	  89	  76    0.07	 540	 531

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It looks like there are two factors giving the Euro a more eastward track of the 850 mb low than the GFS. The first is the fact that the Euro brings the southern stream shortwave and vorticity max farther south than the GFS. This makes the phasing of the southern stream with the upper low to the north and associated northern stream energy less pronounced. The result of this is that the Euro has a less negatively tilted trough at 500 mb with the vorticity advection being more towards the east than the GFS. That promotes QG lift and causes the 850 mb low to track more towards the east over NJ. The GFS produces the best lift from dCVA (differential cyclonic vorticity advection) more towards the north causing the low to track more northward into CNY.

The other factor causing the Euro to track the low farther east is the greater cold air damming along the Appalachians. The Euro is somewhat colder than the GFS at 06z Wednesday with slightly lower thicknesses over the northeast, possibly due to better confluence at 500 mb or perhaps the slower timing of the Euro. The stronger CAD on the Euro results in weaker warm air advection to the north of the 850 mb low and stronger warm air advection to the east of the low over the Delmarva. This causes greater QG lift to the east of the 850 mb than to the north of the low, resulting in a more eastward track. The strong warm advection north of the 850 mb low on the GFS generates lift to the north of the low and thus a more northward track.

I think the positions of the 500 mb southern stream energy by the Euro and GFS are probably equally likely to occur. We won't know which solution is more likely until we get closer in time. However, I think the Euro may have a better handle on the CAD because of its higher resolution than the GFS. That would seem to favor a slightly more eastward track than what the GFS is predicting.

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Morning all, haven't posted in a while...6.5" o/n in no. Syracuse burb, storm total of 13"...solid CNY event. Still trying to snow here. NWS BGM under forecast last night's snowfall here but my location is the far no. fringe of Onon. county.

XMas looks like 2-4" for all.

12/27 promising for CNY, 0Z Euro/GEM with an almost perfect track for BUF/SYR/BGM/ALB.

Thermal profiles could cause some mixing somewhere in ENY and NE PA but too early to get overly granular. GFS would bring a mix to most of us, more of a front end dump then changeover & dry slotting. With a neutral or slightly positive NAO, an out to sea solution seems less likely unless the system just doesn't develop and skirts out as a flat wave. Since all NWP shows decent system development, seems most probable that a somewhat inland track or coastal hugger path will occur.

The other intangible favoring a big hit for CNY is probability. I may be forgetting one, but the last genuine large scale synoptic system to jackpot CNY may have been Valentine's Day 2007. Frankly there haven't been many classic storms that roll up the eastern seaboard and thump the interior while the coastal plain receives mainly rain or mix at best. Most here are too young to remember but this sort of system was very common, actually the norm, in past decades. The past several years have been an aberration in what I'd call snowstorm climo - as evidenced by snow results in BGM and ALB, maybe even ROC/BUF. SYR gets by with lake effect. I lived on/near the I-95 corridor most of my life and I can tell you the past several years of big snowstorms favoring that area is a blessing that I hope they all have appreciated.

Merry Christmas to all and particularly George and Ty.

Go Giants.

-Brian

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Morning all, haven't posted in a while...6.5" o/n in no. Syracuse burb, storm total of 13"...solid CNY event. Still trying to snow here. NWS BGM under forecast last night's snowfall here but my location is the far no. fringe of Onon. county.

XMas looks like 2-4" for all.

12/27 promising for CNY, 0Z Euro/GEM with an almost perfect track for BUF/SYR/BGM/ALB.

Thermal profiles could cause some mixing somewhere in ENY and NE PA but too early to get overly granular. GFS would bring a mix to most of us, more of a front end dump then changeover & dry slotting. With a neutral or slightly positive NAO, an out to sea solution seems less likely unless the system just doesn't develop and skirts out as a flat wave. Since all NWP shows decent system development, seems most probable that a somewhat inland track or coastal hugger path will occur.

The other intangible favoring a big hit for CNY is probability. I may be forgetting one, but the last genuine large scale synoptic system to jackpot CNY may have been Valentine's Day 2007. Frankly there haven't been many classic storms that roll up the eastern seaboard and thump the interior while the coastal plain receives mainly rain or mix at best. Most here are too young to remember but this sort of system was very common, actually the norm, in past decades. The past several years have been an aberration in what I'd call snowstorm climo - as evidenced by snow results in BGM and ALB, maybe even ROC/BUF. SYR gets by with lake effect. I lived on/near the I-95 corridor most of my life and I can tell you the past several years of big snowstorms favoring that area is a blessing that I hope they all have appreciated.

Merry Christmas to all and particularly George and Ty.

Go Giants.

-Brian

Hey Bri!!!!

I came in with 14" total since Friday night. (about 10" on the ground, so quite a "wet" LES, with much less settling than usual)

Christmas snow will be nice!!! Just enough to freshen up our landscape!! Been too long in coming! Next week's storm (actually, this upcoming week's) just looks a bit "off", particularly at h500 (never liked bowling ball transitions, models seem to overdue transfer speed). So I'm still hesitant on (CNY at least) taking a pretty warm solution off the table for this Wed. nt./Thurs. period.

Good to see a post from you. Hopefully the weather will cooperate to see more posts from you this winter!!

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KALB

WED 12Z 26-DEC  -5.9    -3.0    1028	  53	   6    0.00	 557	 536   
WED 18Z 26-DEC  -1.0    -2.3    1023	  47	  51    0.00	 557	 538   
THU 00Z 27-DEC  -2.4    -3.9    1018	  82	 100    0.24	 555	 541   
THU 06Z 27-DEC  -0.8    -4.5    1005	  89	  97    0.44	 549	 545   
THU 12Z 27-DEC   1.0	 0.0	 997	  92	  40    0.59	 540	 542

KSYR

WED 18Z 26-DEC  -2.7    -2.5    1021	  70	  78    0.00	 554	 538   
THU 00Z 27-DEC  -2.8    -1.9    1014	  85	 100    0.41	 551	 540   
THU 06Z 27-DEC  -1.9    -5.5    1004	  88	 100    0.65	 543	 540   
THU 12Z 27-DEC  -2.0    -4.7    1002	  94	  99    0.26	 538	 537   
THU 18Z 27-DEC  -2.7    -8.8    1006	  86	  88    0.07	 538	 533

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KALB

WED 12Z 26-DEC -5.9 -3.0 1028	 53	 6 0.00	 557	 536
WED 18Z 26-DEC -1.0 -2.3 1023	 47	 51 0.00	 557	 538
THU 00Z 27-DEC -2.4 -3.9 1018	 82	 100 0.24	 555	 541
THU 06Z 27-DEC -0.8 -4.5 1005	 89	 97 0.44	 549	 545
THU 12Z 27-DEC 1.0	 0.0	 997	 92	 40 0.59	 540	 542

KSYR

WED 18Z 26-DEC -2.7 -2.5 1021	 70	 78 0.00	 554	 538
THU 00Z 27-DEC -2.8 -1.9 1014	 85	 100 0.41	 551	 540
THU 06Z 27-DEC -1.9 -5.5 1004	 88	 100 0.65	 543	 540
THU 12Z 27-DEC -2.0 -4.7 1002	 94	 99 0.26	 538	 537
THU 18Z 27-DEC -2.7 -8.8 1006	 86	 88 0.07	 538	 533

Can you put in SLK? Appreciate it!

Thanks

-skisheep

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slk

THU 00Z 27-DEC -6.8 -3.6 1021	 70	 92 0.02	 553	 537
THU 06Z 27-DEC -6.3 -6.3 1011	 89	 98 0.58	 549	 541
THU 12Z 27-DEC -4.7 -6.0 1004	 91	 84 0.44	 541	 538
THU 18Z 27-DEC -4.3 -4.9 1002	 92	 97 0.10	 537	 536
FRI 00Z 28-DEC -7.3 -9.4 1007	 93	 95 0.09	 536	 531

NICE! The weather gods knew that I was heading for Whiteface, and a foot of snow makes that place so much more fun!

-skisheep

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