I am not very good at math. do i still have a chance?

[NCsandhills]

SO. Hi all. My name is Aaron and I live in central Arkansas (little rock suburbs) and central NC (fayetteville). Ever since I moved from Los Angeles (same weather every day) to Arkansas (extreme weather every day LOL) in 8th grade i have been FASCINATED by the weather. Actually, I think "obsessed with" is a better description. The Weather Channel is always on, weather.com or accuweather or wunderground is always in a tab, and I have acquired several meteorology textbooks. i am 21 years old. i want nothing more than to become a meteorologist. it is easily my dream job by far.

problems...i am HORRIBLE at math, horrible. in my first semesters at college i was in developmental math, and i failed it. twice. i have looked at curriculum's at several different colleges and they all require Calc, some just to Calc 2 some to Calc 4!!! My grades in high school were C's. my college grades not much better. but thats because i was going to a cruddy community college in arkansas where i wasnt interested in ANYTHING they were teaching me, so i didn't care. my question is do i stand a chance at becoming a meteorologist if i am horrible at maths? perhaps just getting tutored every single day? IF i can even get accepted at a meteorology school. i have applied at UNC asheville for their atmospheric sciences program and i am also interested in the university of wisconsin, SUNY oswego and a few schools in colorado. if i write a college essay expressing my love for the field, do you think i could get accepted even with fairly poor grades? my sat scores was like 1190 or so. i want this so bad =/

i dont want it to just be a hobby. i am currently reading Ahren's textbook "Essentials of Meteorology 5th edition" got it for free

[Ellinwood]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but math is what you're going to be doing the most if you're going for a degree in meteorology. A lot of the junior and senior level met. courses involve a lot of advanced calculus. I've seen people who are mediocre with math squeak through, and I've seen people who are even good at math struggle in some courses. If you can bust your butt and work hard for the whole four years, you might be able to get through, but you can't pass the higher level met. courses if you can't get through the math courses.

[NCsandhills]

you burst my bubble alright can you give me a quick example of some type of math problem a meteorologist will run into on a daily basis? if it's just formulas and plugging in numbers i MIGHT be able to hack it, but i'm dedicated enough to at least try. this is really the only thing i see myself doing with my life.

[wxrjm]

Depending on your occupation, past college, you probably won't use half the math you learn. Broadcast meteorology for example uses little advanced calculus... It's the classes in college that are a problem.

[Ellinwood]

you burst my bubble alright can you give me a quick example of some type of math problem a meteorologist will run into on a daily basis? if it's just formulas and plugging in numbers i MIGHT be able to hack it, but i'm dedicated enough to at least try. this is really the only thing i see myself doing with my life.

More complicated than that. You have formulas with more than one unknown variable, and you have to modify other formulas (deriving and eliminating bits through assumption), then plug those into the original equation, maybe change that around a bit until you can get down to one unknown variable and then solve. It can be tricky.

Depending on your occupation, past college, you probably won't use half the math you learn. Broadcast meteorology for example uses little advanced calculus... It's the classes in college that are a problem.

Unless you're doing computer modeling, you really don't, but you still need the math for the degree.

You can get into broadcast met. without the met. degree, but you'll still probably need one of those certificates that you can get from Mississippi or something. Most jobs require at least a B.S. in Meteorology.

[isohume]

You need the math to see how meteorological variables are interconnected and how theories are developed. It's required in order to gain a deep understanding of the dynamics and physics involved in nature. It's not that they expect you to use it explicitly after you graduate unless, of course, you go into research. Everything needs to be proven in science and math is the language of science.

You shouldn't be afraid of math. It all builds off the previous math as you go along. If you get stuck, almost all colleges and universities offer free tutors.

[NCsandhills]

thank you for the answers. i am trying to learn as much about basic meteorology as i possibly can by myself (again through personally acquired textbooks and the internet) before i even go to a college. i really hope i can at least pass the calc classes with a C, as C's get degrees! lol...i'll just have to get tutored probably after every class. but who knows, maybe since i'm going to be extremely dedicated i will be able to understand it. but prolly not >.<

[isohume]

thank you for the answers. i am trying to learn as much about basic meteorology as i possibly can by myself (again through personally acquired textbooks and the internet) before i even go to a college. i really hope i can at least pass the calc classes with a C, as C's get degrees! lol...i'll just have to get tutored probably after every class. but who knows, maybe since i'm going to be extremely dedicated i will be able to understand it. but prolly not >.<

You don't want nor should you settle for Cs. Academia and agencies like the NWS have way too much competition for you to be competitive in these fields.

[NCsandhills]

You don't want nor should you settle for Cs. Academia and agencies like the NWS have way too much competition for you to be competitive in these fields.

Well I don't WANT C's, trust me but I just can't see myself making a better grade than that in Calculus unless for some reason it just "clicks" for me. which math usually never does. lol

[isohume]

Well I don't WANT C's, trust me but I just can't see myself making a better grade than that in Calculus unless for some reason it just "clicks" for me. which math usually never does. lol

Well, good luck then! Serious, don't be intimidated by calculus. You'll have help if you need it.

[LocoAko]

Well I don't WANT C's, trust me but I just can't see myself making a better grade than that in Calculus unless for some reason it just "clicks" for me. which math usually never does. lol

All competent met programs require up through Calc IV (Ordinary Differential Equations), so I'd bank on that first. I personally have never known someone who wasn't good at math to suddenly have it "click" when it comes to calculus, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. In some weird nerdy way, I think you should want to learn and enjoy the math - maybe solving equations isn't your thing, but the way it describes the atmosphere is just beautiful at times and provides great insight to topics otherwise hard to understand. I know there's an undercurrent among some groups along the lines of "why do we have to bother with this?" when it comes to all the advanced calculus but it really is key.

[NCsandhills]

All competent met programs require up through Calc IV (Ordinary Differential Equations), so I'd bank on that first. I personally have never known someone who wasn't good at math to suddenly have it "click" when it comes to calculus, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. In some weird nerdy way, I think you should want to learn and enjoy the math - maybe solving equations isn't your thing, but the way it describes the atmosphere is just beautiful at times and provides great insight to topics otherwise hard to understand. I know there's an undercurrent among some groups along the lines of "why do we have to bother with this?" when it comes to all the advanced calculus but it really is key.

It probably won't, but they way you described it as the math describing the atmosphere - thats a perfect way to put it and the only reason i can think of it "clicking" for me, just because it IS related to the field.

now i've also read something about industrial meteorology. how does one get into that?

also, how do i get the temperature thingy in my mini profile like y'all got?

[H2Otown_WX]

I know you said you have a lot of textbooks, here is a good one to add to your collection: http://www.amazon.com/Meteorology-Scientists-Engineers-Roland-Stull/dp/0534372147 You can get a feel of what kind of problems you may have to solve and it is mostly algebra-based so you don't have to know calculus, though as others have alluded to, it will be essential that you can at least squeak by in the calculus courses. Also, this book has little boxes called "beyond the algebra" or something like that and you can read those to get a sense of the calculus-based version of whatever topic is described.

[weatherMA]

Like others have said here, actual forecasting involves very little advanced math, but you need the math in college in order to better understand the "language" of the subject. Personally, I think there should be a course even explaining this freshman year so people aren't confused as to WHY you need all of the math you do. It could also include job opportunities, history of meteorology, etc. But that's a totally different topic.

I'm pretty sure that you could do fine with the basic level met classes (sounds like you could already pass intro to met ). The problem would be that math in beginning years, and then the advanced met classes after that. I have always done slightly above average in math, but I wouldn't consider myself good at math. The only reason I'm even above "average" in my view is I put effort in and care about my work. I am in calc 1 now and doing fine, but I'm a little nervous about calc 2 next semester as I've heard it is much worse. I really don't want to accept less then an A- though, so if I need a tutor, that's what I plan to do. Anyway, good luck! I hope you are successful.

[catoctin wx]

thank you for the answers. i am trying to learn as much about basic meteorology as i possibly can by myself (again through personally acquired textbooks and the internet) before i even go to a college. i really hope i can at least pass the calc classes with a C, as C's get degrees! lol...i'll just have to get tutored probably after every class. but who knows, maybe since i'm going to be extremely dedicated i will be able to understand it. but prolly not >.<

Best of luck in your goal! The math needed in the meteorology courses isn't terribly hard most of the time. It has its roots in advanced calculus and ODEs, but most of it is no higher than calc 2.

The hardest part by far (IMO) are the math classes themselves. Struggling through the math involved in Calc I-III and ODE was much much harder than anything I have experienced in undergrad, graduate, or professional life as a meteorologist. I got C's through all the calc classes (failed calc III the first time and re-took it over the summer) and passed ODE with a D (since I didn't need it as a pre-req anymore), but I did well in my meteorology classes because it made sense what was going on, rather than just straight math for math purposes.

My point is that you don't have to be great at math to succeed, but if you aren't great, you need to work your butt off. Take advantage of the tutoring offered. Join study groups. Meet with the prof during office hours for clarification. If you fail a course, take it over. These were all things I needed to do and I made it through.

It won't be easy, but nothing in life that is worth doing ever is!

Good luck!

[Ground Scouring]

Much depends upon how deep your deficits in math are. Keep in mind that you also have other courses to take care of. Realistically, tutoring can only cover a certain percentage of deficiencies before it consumes an inordinate amount of time--and in the collegiate and post-college worlds, your math grades will not make much of a difference if you spend so much time honing your skills that you fail other, more trivial classes. At some point, however difficult (or painful) the judgment may be, you will need to assess whether you have a realistic shot at mastering the requisites without ruining the rest of your education. If you can only scrape by to pursue your major--and find yourself struggling to focus on your other courses--I would seriously consider discarding meteorology and pursuing a less-intensive minor which might still overlap meteorological concepts. I had to make the same judgment, which has since led to my majoring in history, though I still have an interest in weather. Good luck.

[AtticaFanatica]

This thread reminds me how bad I was in high school physics (mechanics), glad I didn't quit.

[NCsandhills]

Best of luck in your goal! The math needed in the meteorology courses isn't terribly hard most of the time. It has its roots in advanced calculus and ODEs, but most of it is no higher than calc 2.

The hardest part by far (IMO) are the math classes themselves. Struggling through the math involved in Calc I-III and ODE was much much harder than anything I have experienced in undergrad, graduate, or professional life as a meteorologist. I got C's through all the calc classes (failed calc III the first time and re-took it over the summer) and passed ODE with a D (since I didn't need it as a pre-req anymore), but I did well in my meteorology classes because it made sense what was going on, rather than just straight math for math purposes.

My point is that you don't have to be great at math to succeed, but if you aren't great, you need to work your butt off. Take advantage of the tutoring offered. Join study groups. Meet with the prof during office hours for clarification. If you fail a course, take it over. These were all things I needed to do and I made it through.

It won't be easy, but nothing in life that is worth doing ever is!

Good luck!

Thank you very much for the well wishes! Thats what I'm afraid of, is doing the math in Calc just for calc purposes...i feel like if i could do calc that is directly related to meteorology then i would be able to pass, but calc just for calc...scares me. i could BARELY pass geometry and algebra 2 for cryin out loud. but i want this so bad. i think i have to at least try. if i can get accepted that is.

Much depends upon how deep your deficits in math are. Keep in mind that you also have other courses to take care of. Realistically, tutoring can only cover a certain percentage of deficiencies before it consumes an inordinate amount of time--and in the collegiate and post-college worlds, your math grades will not make much of a difference if you spend so much time honing your skills that you fail other, more trivial classes. At some point, however difficult (or painful) the judgment may be, you will need to assess whether you have a realistic shot at mastering the requisites without ruining the rest of your education. If you can only scrape by to pursue your major--and find yourself struggling to focus on your other courses--I would seriously consider discarding meteorology and pursuing a less-intensive minor which might still overlap meteorological concepts. I had to make the same judgment, which has since led to my majoring in history, though I still have an interest in weather. Good luck.

i really dont know if i can settle for something else. weather and meteorolgoy is my passion. even if i'm bad at math. everything about wx fascinates me deeply and genuinely. there is quite literally nothing else i want to do with my life. i dont want to be just some plumber or teacher or manager and like the weather. meteorology and the wx already consumes my life, as far as i'm concerned i might as well get paid for it lol. i've chased many many storms and called in several confirmed tornadoes, and even aided in search and rescue. it just sucks that i am no good at math and thats whats going to prevent me from living out my dream.

[CardinalWinds]

I graduated high school in 1981. My math skills are abysmal. I tried to focus on Meterology in college, but the math was beyond me. I'm a writer, not a mathematician. As a result I got into radio broadcasting instead. I am a rabid weather weenie. Maybe nowadays the emphasis on math skills are not as cumbersome, but , alas, in my time it kept me out of a career in forecasting.

[isohume]

I graduated high school in 1981. My math skills are abysmal. I tried to focus on Meterology in college, but the math was beyond me. I'm a writer, not a mathematician. As a result I got into radio broadcasting instead. I am a rabid weather weenie. Maybe nowadays the emphasis on math skills are not as cumbersome, but , alas, in my time it kept me out of a career in forecasting.

The math curriculum has actually gotten harder for federal jobs in the past 30 years. DFQ is now required.

[LocoAko]

The math curriculum has actually gotten harder for federal jobs in the past 30 years. DFQ is now required.

Did it not used to be? Interesting.

[isohume]

Did it not used to be? Interesting.

It was added by the AMS in the early 90s. Most folks we're grandfathered in, but others had to go take the course after they graduated in order to qualify for NWS positions. Met programs added it to the degree after that.