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Who Needs Hazel When You Have Sandy


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yeah but its a good step alot of them earlier took sandy ots and didnt bring her back :)

Was thinking the same thing. But I don't know much so didn't say anything. Overall I think the fact that the recurve is happening more frequently is great. I too hope for massive destruction.

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Strength and intensity is an issue but it is showing less spread going completely OTS. To me that is a significant thing.

Yes. Agreed.

If this continues the op GFS OTS track may be off the table.

Then we're left to figure out if it's a brush-by nor'easter... a retro kind of nor'easter... or a full fledged hurricane.

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Yes. Agreed.

If this continues the op GFS OTS track may be off the table.

Then we're left to figure out if it's a brush-by nor'easter... a retro kind of nor'easter... or a full fledged hurricane.

Euro would still remain on the left side of the GEFS ensemble individual members , but I think there is at least some hints of convergence to a solution. That can all get wiped away in a couple of hours though -- we're still at the range where anything is on the table, really.

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Can I add one more...I do not think this will be tropical this far north rather a nor'easter that stemmed from tropical characteristics... :underthewx:

Yes. Agreed.

If this continues the op GFS OTS track may be off the table.

Then we're left to figure out if it's a brush-by nor'easter... a retro kind of nor'easter... or a full fledged hurricane.

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Can I add one more...I do not think this will be tropical this far north rather a nor'easter that stemmed from tropical characteristics... :underthewx:

Yeah... it may still be warm core... but no doubt a hybrid.

That said some of our big storms (1938) have been hybrids... which I still consider a hurricane lol.

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any one scratching their head why the NHC has this thing to the right of the CMC, UKMET, ECMWF and its ENS and the GEFS at this point on its day 4/5 progs. what am i missing. do they give extraordinary weight to the GFS OP and other models derived from that?

First, they are not ones to deviate quick...a good way to approach forecasting in the day 4-5 range.

Secondly, lots of the cyclone guidance is GFS based so that's something to consider. Of course, that does not mean they have to be OTS because these models do use different parameterizations.

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I think the NHC keeps it going and names it subtropical. There would be absolutely no benefit to the public for doing anything else.

I'm getting the distinct impression from the most recent NHC advisories that they are looking forward to washing their hands of it ASAP and declaring it extratropical, or at least want to. In the first advisories they were talking a lot about it being subtropical.

I bet the NHC-HPC coordination calls have been interesting already, and they'll be getting more interesting in the future.

Assuming the Storm o' Doom verifies, I agree that for the public nothing would be worse than issuing a last advisory because it's "Extratropical" (even though that may be true) as it's off North Carolina or something.

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First, they are not ones to deviate quick...a good way to approach forecasting in the day 4-5 range.

Right. Hurricane forecasting is fundamentally different in some ways than conventional weather forecasting. It's a different thing to forecast a line or cone track for a focal point five days out than to estimate the progress of a frontal system.

If anything, the NHC's position forecast should be a red flag against any forecast/guidance pulling Sandy westwards early on - these guys may play it 'safe' in terms of trends, but do know what they're doing.

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