HIPPYVALLEY Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I completely agree on relative to averages. I've never questioned that. I think I'm too close to those crests (down and then back up) for any downsloping. That doesn't kick in until you're heading into G'field. As far as cooling goes, I don't radiate for sh*t. I'm always one of the warmest overnight spots not only in the region, but I think for a lot of SNE. lol Anyway--let's get back to more general discussion rather than the idiosyncracies of the Pit. But, visitors are welcome. I still invite Chris to take away some wood. The heat rolls down the Mohawk Trail right into downtown Greenfield and Deerfield but it's not neaerly as bad as the wider valley from Northampton to Springfield which will absolutely bake this week. Although I'm only a few miles from G'field ctr the summer temp differential can often be as much as 5 degrees due to elevation gain and dense forest. I'll come get some wood but I can't fit much in the Subaru. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Some good battles today. Bravo. Haha its a refreshing argument we haven't had in a couple weeks...but we'll do it again during the next heat wave when Pete claims a 20F lapse rate It's apples and oranges like you said...I think of it like comparing snowfall totals measured once every 24 hours at 12z (say CoOps) vs. ones measured every 6 hours all winter long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 Thursday has an east coast seabreeze signal imo. Could be something where Logan is 82 and I'm 98 or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Some good battles today. Bravo. All I'll add is that although the home stations may be close to accurately measuring everyones forested microclimates they may not be properly sited to make comparisons to the airport stations. It's like comparing apples to oranges if someone in the jungle in C MA at 700ft claims their max summer temps are colder on average than ORH. I think that's the key. You're measuring your own microclimate so it is hard to compare at a moment in time to an airport station. You can, however, compare to other home stations, imo because the siting will be similar. Long term though, you should be able to compare averages and normals if you keep a long enough record so departures would be more clear. That being said...looks like its going to be hot at many places Wednesday & Thursday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Yes. This. I could put a dew point sensor right above the lawn that I just watered and on a summer day you'll get a nasty looking dew point. While the dew point may actually be 80 degrees at that location you can't compare it to an ASOS reading at an airport. It's a totally different comparison. Using your own readings to compare against previous events at your own station is fine but that's about the most you can do. At least the airports with where they're sited and the requirements for siting an ASOS allow us to make useful comparisons between them. There's no way I could compare Kevin's weenie thermometer to mine and to BDL's. Apples and oranges. So where is yours situated? It had better not be within 50 feet of any grass or trees or the Thermonazi will get you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 I think that's the key. You're measuring your own microclimate so it is hard to compare at a moment in time to an airport station. You can, however, compare to other home stations, imo because the siting will be similar. Long term though, you should be able to compare averages and normals if you keep a long enough record so departures would be more clear. That being said...looks like its going to be hot at many places Wednesday & Thursday! And that's true, but imo it gives you more of the skin type conditions, rather than the true boundary layer conditions in the lower couple of hundred feet or so, among the local forested areas argument that we have been saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 So where is yours situated? It had better not be within 50 feet of any grass or trees or the Thermonazi will get you It's not easy in our setups. I know mine likely reads too warm in certain situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 So where is yours situated? It had better not be within 50 feet of any grass or trees or the Thermonazi will get you So it can't be over grass, under trees, over pavement, or water. That leaves what, putting it over the kids' sandbox? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 So it can't be over grass, under trees, over pavement, or water. That leaves what, putting it over the kids' sandbox? Either there or the top of the chimney seem like the only correct places Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoon Tip Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 You guys may think it's funny but this isn't being taken seriously, I feel. Phili has the watch flying and I believe it will be necessary if DPs are 60 and the mercury topples 100 for much of the urban corridor there, to here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 So it can't be over grass, under trees, over pavement, or water. That leaves what, putting it over the kids' sandbox? On a snow steak at 4k. Who said anything about it being place in a wrong area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Rain Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 So where is yours situated? It had better not be within 50 feet of any grass or trees or the Thermonazi will get you That's not what anyone said. Reading comprehension skills FTL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 That's not what anyone said. Reading comprehension skills FTL. As usual. This subforum would be a disaster if it weren't for corrections to weenie posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 MOS still has 96-98 for a large portion of SNE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 So it can't be over grass, under trees, over pavement, or water. That leaves what, putting it over the kids' sandbox? I thought the guidace used to be over natural vegetation and if you couldn't do that it had to be so many feet from the surface. Mine is in a CRS or Stevenson screen surrounded by grass but i have a hill to my west shades me from about 3 or 4pm on so I never get as high as some other areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 That's not what anyone said. Reading comprehension skills FTL. So answer the ? Where us yours situated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalcottWx Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Thursday has an east coast seabreeze signal imo. Could be something where Logan is 82 and I'm 98 or something. I would honestly love to sit down discuss/learn as much as possible about our east coast seabreeze stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 So what about the winter when there is no vegetation? Why the difference then? Maybe in the winter I should place it on top of my snow bank out by the street Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I would honestly love to sit down discuss/learn as much as possible about our east coast seabreeze stuff. He doesn't want to date you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 So what about the winter when there is no vegetation? Why the difference then? Maybe in the winter I should place it on top of my snow bank out by the street Might as well put it on top of the transmitter on Mt Baldy because it reads the temp at 1500' anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 I would honestly love to sit down discuss/learn as much as possible about our east coast seabreeze stuff. Well, the model wind depictions are hinting at it, that's all. I'm not making a crazy assumption or anything. Winds aloft look light and with such strong heating..it is possible. Might be very localized and weak, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 Anyways..enough already..lol. Hopefully everyone including "wind in his hair" is above 90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 On a snow steak at 4k. Who said anything about it being place in a wrong area? well played Picnic tables are where it's at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamarack Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Some good battles today. Bravo. All I'll add is that although the home stations may be close to accurately measuring everyones forested microclimates they may not be properly sited to make comparisons to the airport stations. It's like comparing apples to oranges if someone in the jungle in C MA at 700ft claims their max summer temps are colder on average than ORH. I'll echo the others - nicely put. A local example: The COOP observations in Farmington run about 2F higher than mine, despite being the same elev and only 6 miles away. However, that setup is standard, over a maintained lawn about 30' from Rt 4 (two paved lanes) and 40-50' from the nearest trees. My thermometer is on the shady side of a house surrounded by trees. Thus the 2F discrepancy is due to transpirational cooling when the leaves are green. In winter I'm colder, in the mornings anyway, because of my flat-at-hill-bottom frost pocket, while the COOP is on slight sidehill. In any wider scale comparison of temps, I'd recommend giving lots more weight to the COOP numbers than to mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Anyways..enough already..lol. Hopefully everyone including "wind in his hair" is above 90. Since we are talking about...it any guesses for high temp reached at 4k? I'm thinking 75F... with 63F at MWN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I'll echo the others - nicely put. A local example: The COOP observations in Farmington run about 2F higher than mine, despite being the same elev and only 6 miles away. However, that setup is standard, over a maintained lawn about 30' from Rt 4 (two paved lanes) and 40-50' from the nearest trees. My thermometer is on the shady side of a house surrounded by trees. Thus the 2F discrepancy is due to transpirational cooling when the leaves are green. In winter I'm colder, in the mornings anyway, because of my flat-at-hill-bottom frost pocket, while the COOP is on slight sidehill. In any wider scale comparison of temps, I'd recommend giving lots more weight to the COOP numbers than to mine. I agree...nice discussions today. They have been missed! Speaking of coops, I wonder why more of them don't have real-time reporting sensors in their shelters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 Since we are talking about...it any guesses for high temp reached at 4k? I'm thinking 75F... with 63F at MWN. Sounds right, although I'd have to look more into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 I'm anxious to hear where Ryan has his. Sounds like he's got it in a wide open field behind his house. There are plenty of those in West Hartford. Maybe even post a pic or two so others can learn how to properly situate/place theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TalcottWx Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 He doesn't want to date you Wiz wants to date you. Hey I just want to learn the meteorology behind our microclimate... we actually have one you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoon Tip Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Would you like a job with the NWS? You could be the excessive heat watch issuer Fwiw, the GFSX MOS product is officially a heat wave for all majors < 1,000' el Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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