PhillipS Posted August 1, 2012 Author Share Posted August 1, 2012 He quietly released it? LOL. Yeah it was so quite he put it right there in his blog post and easy to find. As for USHCN, he looked at their Version 2. You still haven't backed up your claim that there is a conspiracy within the NCDC to undermine the temperature record. Are you just a 'Seagull Troll' - one that flies in, makes a lot of noise, craps all over, and then flies off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben4vols Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Well, apparently Anthony didn't get the memo since he's still using the first iteration. And even you are still quoting his statements that were based on his initial flawed attempt at creating a US temperature record. His quotes were pertaining to USHCN V2. I find it funny that some of you who have derided the US temperature record because it only used a subset of stations and was subject to adjustment have adopted Dr. Spencer's temperature record, which uses a much smaller subset of station and is subject to even greater adjustment! Why were a subset of stations used? There is a reason for it, which you would know if you had actually read it in detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 1, 2012 Author Share Posted August 1, 2012 His quotes were pertaining to USHCN V2. Why were a subset of stations used? There is a reason for it, which you would know if you had actually read it in detail. Are you saying that Dr Spencer's reasons for adjustments trump NOAA's reasons for adjustments? Who made him omniscient? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben4vols Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 Are you saying that Dr Spencer's reasons for adjustments trump NOAA's reasons for adjustments? Who made him omniscient? Why don't you quit putting words in my mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 2, 2012 Author Share Posted August 2, 2012 Why don't you quit putting words in my mouth. I'm not putting words in your mouth - I'm simply asking you to back up your wild claims. Here is what you wrote about Dr Spencer's reasons for using only a small subset of weather stations in his temperature trend calculations:: Why were a subset of stations used? There is a reason for it, which you would know if you had actually read it in detail. I've read Dr Spencer's site and failed to find any rationale of his for ignoring most of the US weather stations. So it is fair to ask you to support your assertion. If you know where he explains his methodology then share it with us. Otherwise it just appears he cherrypicked weather stations to get the answer he wanted. And lest we forget, earlier today you claimed that there is a conspiracy within the NCDC to undermine the accuracy of the temperature record by making adjustments "for political reasons" I believe is how you put it. Several times now I have asked you to share the data you feel supports your claim - but you haven't done so. Perhaps it just slipped your mind and you'll provide the info now. Or perhaps you lack even a shred of honesty or integrity and will continue to dodge answering. How you respond to this will help all of the curious readers better understand your motives and credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 Statement as of 11:45 PM CDT on August 3, 2012 ... New record maximum temperature set at Oklahoma City... ... New record warm minimum temperature at Oklahoma City... Todays maximum temperature at Will Rogers World Airport in Oklahoma City was 113 degrees. This breaks the previous record maximum temperature of 109 degrees, set on this date in 2011. This also ties the warmest maximum temperature on record. The record was last reached on August 11th 1936. The minimum temperature of 84 degrees is also the warmest minimum on record. The previous record warm minimum of 83 degrees was last reached on August 13th 1936. Temperature records for Oklahoma City date back to 1891. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Global_Warmer Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 His quotes were pertaining to USHCN V2. Why were a subset of stations used? There is a reason for it, which you would know if you had actually read it in detail. I asked this question before here a couple times I also have not found an answer. I also haven't seen a TOBS explanation for the Spencer temp record either. You read it in detail please explain it to me well us here wanting the truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Global_Warmer Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 Statement as of 11:45 PM CDT on August 3, 2012 ... New record maximum temperature set at Oklahoma City... ... New record warm minimum temperature at Oklahoma City... Todays maximum temperature at Will Rogers World Airport in Oklahoma City was 113 degrees. This breaks the previous record maximum temperature of 109 degrees, set on this date in 2011. This also ties the warmest maximum temperature on record. The record was last reached on August 11th 1936. The minimum temperature of 84 degrees is also the warmest minimum on record. The previous record warm minimum of 83 degrees was last reached on August 13th 1936. Temperature records for Oklahoma City date back to 1891. St. Louis broke it's all time July monthly temperature record. There is a good chance summer will be warmest on record after Spring was. I don't think that has ever happened in the 143 year temperature record here. Before the record keeping was at the airport here in the 1960s it was downtown on a roof for a while. Going back the info became harder to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toronto blizzard Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 St. Louis broke it's all time July monthly temperature record. There is a good chance summer will be warmest on record after Spring was. I don't think that has ever happened in the 143 year temperature record here. Before the record keeping was at the airport here in the 1960s it was downtown on a roof for a while. Going back the info became harder to find. And of course you will definitely blame this hot spring and summer on AGW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 7, 2012 Author Share Posted August 7, 2012 And of course you will definitely blame this hot spring and summer on AGW I'm certain that AGW contributed to it. If you don't feel AGW was a factor in the hottest spring and hot summer in the US can you share any research or just your unsupported opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toronto blizzard Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 I'm certain that AGW contributed to it. If you don't feel AGW was a factor in the hottest spring and hot summer in the US can you share any research or just your unsupported opinion? What makes you so sure that AGW has contributed to it. Please explain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellinwood Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 What makes you so sure that AGW has contributed to it. Please explain What makes you sure that it didn't? Please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toronto blizzard Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 What makes you sure that it didn't? Please explain. You can't just say that AGW is the cause of the warmest spring and now possibly summer in the U.S. That's bad reasoning. I have almost had it with all you close-minded people about this topic. You simply cannot have a debate in this forum because you Pro-AGW folks just won't allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellinwood Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 You can't just say that AGW is the cause of the warmest spring and now possibly summer in the U.S. That's bad reasoning. I have almost had it with all you close-minded people about this topic. You simply cannot have a debate in this forum because you Pro-AGW folks just won't allow it. I never said whether AGW did or did not help cause it. I want to hear your argument as to why it didn't. If you ask people to prove that it did, it's only fair to give your own evidence that would prove the contrary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toronto blizzard Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 I never said whether AGW did or did not help cause it. I want to hear your argument as to why it didn't. If you ask people to prove that it did, it's only fair to give your own evidence that would prove the contrary. There are many natural factors that may have contributed to it more so than AGW and I believe Scott (CoastalWX) explained why about how the dry winter really created a feedback and that's why it was so warm in March and now the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 There are many natural factors that may have contributed to it more so than AGW and I believe Scott (CoastalWX) explained why about how the dry winter really created a feedback and that's why it was so warm in March and now the summer. But it's very unlikely that the magnitude of the extremes would have occurred without the long term warming trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeatherRusty Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 What makes you so sure that AGW has contributed to it. Please explain Radiative physics. Theoretic expectations. Probability theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellinwood Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 There are many natural factors that may have contributed to it more so than AGW and I believe Scott (CoastalWX) explained why about how the dry winter really created a feedback and that's why it was so warm in March and now the summer. It was dry along the coasts, but the warmest area of the spring was in the middle of the country, right where the wettest winter anomalies were. I doubt that the winter precip had much of a feedback on the spring temperatures. The dryness may have enhanced the heat in the Southwest and along the East Coast, but that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeatherRusty Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 There are many natural factors that may have contributed to it more so than AGW and I believe Scott (CoastalWX) explained why about how the dry winter really created a feedback and that's why it was so warm in March and now the summer. First order causation will never be AGW. The causes of weather are the same as always, but these are now playing out in a warmer environment. Do you think a warmer environment might change some of the dynamics of weather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toronto blizzard Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 But it's very unlikely that the magnitude of the extremes would have occurred without the long term warming trend. What makes you so sure about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entropy Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 St. Louis broke it's all time July monthly temperature record. There is a good chance summer will be warmest on record after Spring was. I don't think that has ever happened in the 143 year temperature record here. Before the record keeping was at the airport here in the 1960s it was downtown on a roof for a while. Going back the info became harder to find. Nothing unusual going on. We've just shifted St. Louis into northern Texas. Maybe those darn Mayans were on to something after all. St. Louis 2012 Mean Temperature (1/1-7/31): 63.1F 1961-1990 normal (1/1-7/31): 55.3F Difference: +7.8F Oklahoma City, OK 1961-1990 normal (1/1-7/31): 59.3F Difference: +3.8F Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX 1961-1990 normal* (1/1-7/31): 64.7F Difference: -1.6F * Not available on WRCC website. Derived from official NWS LCDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 What makes you so sure about that? It's what you would expect to happen in a warming climate. https://www2.ucar.edu/atmosnews/news/1036/record-high-temperatures-far-outpace-record-lows-across-us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben4vols Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 But it's very unlikely that the magnitude of the extremes would have occurred without the long term warming trend. How much warming was added to those temps as "adjustments"? How much warming was taken away from say the 30's as "adjustments"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 7, 2012 Author Share Posted August 7, 2012 How much warming was added to those temps as "adjustments"? How much warming was taken away from say the 30's as "adjustments"? Again you imply a conspiracy within the NCDC to undermine the temperature record - we are still waiting for your evidence that adjustments were done for political motivations as you claim. Supply some evidence or give it a rest - this is not a forum for tinfoil hat conspiracies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben4vols Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Again you imply a conspiracy within the NCDC to undermine the temperature record - we are still waiting for your evidence that adjustments were done for political motivations as you claim. Supply some evidence or give it a rest - this is not a forum for tinfoil hat conspiracies No conspiracy. The data was changed. It could be random chance that those in charge of making the changes happen to wholeheartedly support AGW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Global_Warmer Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 We dont hear much about how data can be skewed from downtown rooftop thermos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 7, 2012 Author Share Posted August 7, 2012 No conspiracy. The data was changed. It could be random chance that those in charge of making the changes happen to wholeheartedly support AGW. So you have no evidence whatsoever that the adjustments were unorthodox or improper. And you understand that the BESTproject found that there is no problem with the NCDC temperature record. So I suppose you just brought it up as innuendo to try to cast doubt on the record temperatures being seen this spring and summer. How scientific of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Global_Warmer Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 We dont hear much about how data can be skewed from downtown rooftop thermos. Because that wouldn't cause super hot high temps to be skewed would it? I think it would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipS Posted August 9, 2012 Author Share Posted August 9, 2012 NOAA announced that July, 2012, was the hottest July ever recorded for the lower 48. From the NOAA SOTC post: Drought expands to cover nearly 63% of the Lower 48; wildfires consume 2 million acres The average temperature for the contiguous U.S. during July was 77.6°F, 3.3°F above the 20th century average, marking the hottest July and the hottest month on record for the nation. The previous warmest July for the nation was July 1936 when the average U.S. temperature was 77.4°F. The warm July temperatures contributed to a record-warm first seven months of the year and the warmest 12-month period the nation has experienced since recordkeeping began in 1895. Precipitation totals were mixed during July, with the contiguous U.S. as a whole being drier than average. The nationally averaged precipitation total of 2.57 inches was 0.19 inch below average. Near-record dry conditions were present for the middle of the nation, with the drought footprint expanding to cover nearly 63 percent of the Lower 48, according the U.S. Drought Monitor. Now, any guesses on how long it will take for the deniers on this forum to claim that July was only hottest because of 'adjustments'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben4vols Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I think everyone knows it was due to the adjustments. Is the hottest July ever for the lower 48 due to correct adjustments, that is the better question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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