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NNE Spring 2012

ctsnowstorm628

By ctsnowstorm628,
in New England

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powderfreak

powderfreak

Posted
Posted

Still away, PF?

Indeed, it feels very refreshing out there this morning and yep, perhaps frosty for some by morning.

I'm not back in Stowe till June 6th...getting ready for two weeks in Norway now, wandering the mountains and fjords there. I don't take any vacations or time off Nov-Apr (worked 430am Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Years, etc) with 60hr weeks, but the trade off is money/time to burn before summer/fall tourism season starts.

Though some have argued that my work weeks are actually vacations cause my home-base is 1550ft on one of the snowiest locations east of the Rockies, where I get to weenie out to mountain weather and snowfall, while skiing and taking photos of it, all winter long ;)

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Allenson

Allenson

Posted
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That's a chilly morning for May, border. 33F here this morning but there is some light frost on the grass. Put it in the books!

I'm not back in Stowe till June 6th...getting ready for two weeks in Norway now, wandering the mountains and fjords there. I don't take any vacations or time off Nov-Apr (worked 430am Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Years, etc) with 60hr weeks, but the trade off is money/time to burn before summer/fall tourism season starts.

Sweet, man. I never did make it to Scandinavia on any of my trips but it's certainly on my proverbial bucket list. Beautiful scenery, beautiful women, the works. ;)

You might be able to find some snow and skiing....?

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mreaves

mreaves

Posted
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28F, patchy frost, as in 2 patches up here on the hill. lots of dew that needed another hour in the dark to solidify

not a cloud to be seen for 50 miles

That's a chilly morning for May, border. 33F here this morning but there is some light frost on the grass. Put it in the books!

Sweet, man. I never did make it to Scandinavia on any of my trips but it's certainly on my proverbial bucket list. Beautiful scenery, beautiful women, the works. ;)

You might be able to find some snow and skiing....?

34° at my house. No frost on my lawn but there was some patchy stuff further down the hill. Had to scrape my windshield, possibly for the last time until September.

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tamarack

tamarack

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Frost on the pickup roof this morning, low about 31. My average date for last frost is about May 25, so we're close. I've had frost in 4 of 14 Junes, but none in the past 5 yr.

1st TS of the year late Wed evening (so Thursday on my observations); frequent thunder though nothing close, and 0.15", bringing May up to 3.06". That's about 0.7" above my avg for 5/1-18, but we've had measurable precip on 12 of the 1st 17 days this month. Lots of clouds, frequent light rains, leaves out about 2/3 on maples, 1/4 on the one oak, with ash lagging behind. Blackflies should be prime this weekend.

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powderfreak

powderfreak

Posted
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Looks like a beautiful day back home... enjoy it guys!

Morrisville-Stowe had a low of 32F this morning so I bet there was some patchy frost in the Stowe area as well, similar to what the rest of you reported.

MVL for 32F this morning and already up to 70F this afternoon... gotta love those clear days with wide swings in temps. Those are my favorite warm season type days.

Overnight lows from BTV:

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powderfreak

powderfreak

Posted
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I made this post in the Ski Thread regarding our mid-winter "nickel and dime" or nickel and penny season... but the reason I did this was I was looking through my photos from the past winter and it seemed like it snowed most days. So I looked at the CoCoRAHS observations and it turns out that in this area during January into early February, it snowed at least a trace on 85% of the days. And that's not on the mountain, that's miles away down in the village. The mountain's ratio during this time was likely even higher...90%+.

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powderfreak

powderfreak

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I've been relaxing and taking it easy for a couple days on vacation and for whatever reason I am having huge snow and winter weather withdrawals... so I've been perusing J.Spin's website ( http://jandeproducti...om/weather.html) to relive past year's winter storms. I'm also comparing the storms and his Waterbury data to the Stowe Village CoCoRAHS observers. I love the CoCoRAHS ability to compare reports in the past in graphical form (http://www.cocorahs....nowSummary.aspx) and given that J.Spin and whoever the Stowe Village observer is both report everyday, its a wonderful source of local information.

Now, I knew that where I am and where J.Spin is are usually very close to each other in terms of snowfall, snow depth, and precipitation but did not know just how similar we were. Of course we aren't that far from each other (maybe 15 miles?) but the precipitation amounts are incredibly close to each other.

I'm currently going through the 2010-2011 winter season, and although there are some snowfall differences, the QPF amounts between our two locations from October 1, 2010 through May 21, 2011 (picked randomly because it was today's date but changed the year to look at last year) are only about a half inch different. I assume the large snowfall difference may be related to snowfall measuring techniques, but I do believe J.Spin gets the slight nod in pure snowfall, but the amount of actual QPF that falls from the sky is very similar in each storm. I have no idea if the Stowe guy measures only once a day or if he measures more diligently like J, but overall the total liquid comes out very similar.

And oftentimes, the two stations are dead on identical (or as close as you can get for two spots 15 miles apart)... take this period in 2011 for example where Stowe Village and J.Spin's location had just about the same liquid, same snowfall, same snow depths.

I know this isn't relevant to anything or anyone... just amazed how close the liquid amounts are between the two locations given how widely variable the weather is in this area because of the mountains.

Even this past February (Feb 1 - March 1) saw identical precipitation amounts between the two locations.

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j24vt

j24vt

Posted
Posted

Here are my readings from last year. I use a setup pretty similar to JSpin's. We are on the beginning of Stagecoach Road about 2 miles northeast of Stowe and about 6 miles east of Mt Mansfield.

Elevation : 725' 2009-2010 Total Snowfall: 87.6" 2010-2011 Total: 140.6" 2011-2012 Total: 88.4"

30OCT11 0900 0.9" 02JAN12 2200 2.4" 31JAN12 1900 1.6" 02APR12 0700 0.2"

18NOV11 0630 0.2" 03JAN12 0630 0.3" 04FEB12 0800 1.9"

23NOV11 0730 6.5" 05JAN12 1200 2.5" 13FEB12 1200 1.1"

23NOV11 1230 2.6" 06JAN12 0700 0.9" 18FEB12 0700 0.7"

23NOV11 2200 0.2" 08JAN12 0900 0.9" 22FEB12 0700 1.6"

02DEC11 1799 0.4" 12JAN12 1800 2.8 24FEB12 2230 4.3"

08DEC11 0700 2.9" 13JAN12 0600 0.3" 25FEB12 0600 3.2"

14DEC11 0700 0.3" 13JAN12 1900 5.2" 25FEB12 1930 7.8"

17DEC11 0800 1.7" 13JAN12 2300 4.7" 26FEB12 0630 1.4"

23DEC11 1100 2.6" 13JAN12 0700 0.6" 26FEB12 0700 2.2"

23DEC11 2200 1.8" 20JAN12 0700 3.7" 01MAR12 2000 6.0"

24DEC11 0700 0.2" 21JAN12 1300 2.4" 04MAR12 2000 1.3"

25DEC11 1300 1.8" 25JAN12 0700 0.3" 05MAR12 0700 0.2"

25DEC11 2000 2.4 27JAN12 0730 2.5" 09MAR12 0700 0.4"

26DEC11 0900 2.6" 28JAN12 0800 0.3" 09MAR12 0700 1.3"

29DEC11 0700 1.7" 29JAN12 0900 0.4" 26MAR12 0800 0.4"

30DEC11 2000 0.8" 30JAN12 0700 1.1" 28MAR12 0700 0.3"

31DEC11 0830 0.4" 31JAN12 0700 0.5" 30MAR12 0800 0.3"

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J.Spin

J.Spin

Posted
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I've been relaxing and taking it easy for a couple days on vacation and for whatever reason I am having huge snow and winter weather withdrawals... so I've been perusing J.Spin's website ( http://jandeproducti...om/weather.html) to relive past year's winter storms. I'm also comparing the storms and his Waterbury data to the Stowe Village CoCoRAHS observers. I love the CoCoRAHS ability to compare reports in the past in graphical form (http://www.cocorahs....nowSummary.aspx) and given that J.Spin and whoever the Stowe Village observer is both report everyday, its a wonderful source of local information.

Great work PF! It’s so fun to be able to pop onto the board and see these types of analyses being done (it hits home even more of course when you are using data from our station). Indeed, that CoCoRaHS site is an incredible resource – I’d recommend CoCoRaHS participation to anyone that has the time and enjoys data collection, because participating there essentially provides a very robust and easy way to look at the data one collects. It’s really impressive just how close that total liquid is between the two sites. With such similar total liquid, I have to assume like you that snowfall differences are probably derived from things like frequency of measurement and sheltering from the wind that preserve loft. Like you said, there could be a slight edge in snowfall around in this area being closer to the western slopes, so that might provide a few fluffy inches, but I’m sure that with the rate at which upslope snow settles, one could easily lose two to three feet of snowfall depth over the course of a season. With 40-50 accumulating snowstorms each season, even an average of a half inch to an inch of settling per storm would add up to quite a bit if one is making 6 or 12-hour measurements vs. 24-hour measurements. One can see that total liquid is a good equalizer for those effects though as long as one is diligent about getting the total liquid equivalent in the cold months. I checked out station VT-CH-4 (Underhill 4.4 NNE) since I know that is up there on the west slope close to 1,000’ in elevation and is a real hot spot for upslope snow totals. I was curious if that area actually gets more total liquid than this area and the Stowe area, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. For the 10/1/2010 to 6/1/2011 period the totals there were 223.0” snow on 46.13” liquid vs. 197.0” snow on 46.92” liquid at our site. There’s probably some advantage there with snowfall, being right on the western slopes and up around 1,000’, but the total precipitation would argue for good loft preservation and/or someone who is able to be at the board every six hours for snow measurement.

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powderfreak

powderfreak

Posted
Posted

One can see that total liquid is a good equalizer for those effects though as long as one is diligent about getting the total liquid equivalent in the cold months. I checked out station VT-CH-4 (Underhill 4.4 NNE) since I know that is up there on the west slope close to 1,000’ in elevation and is a real hot spot for upslope snow totals. I was curious if that area actually gets more total liquid than this area and the Stowe area, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. For the 10/1/2010 to 6/1/2011 period the totals there were 223.0” snow on 46.13” liquid vs. 197.0” snow on 46.92” liquid at our site. There’s probably some advantage there with snowfall, being right on the western slopes and up around 1,000’, but the total precipitation would argue for good loft preservation and/or someone who is able to be at the board every six hours for snow measurement.

Yeah looking at the total precipitation amounts has been very interesting to me over the past couple of days. I've been waiting in airports (I love how European airports have free WiFi everywhere, something that larger American airports haven't caught on to... gotta pay for everything in America) and have been passing time looking through this stuff.

Some first conclusions that I've come to looking over your website, as well as the CoCoRAHS sites is that:

1) You get the majority of your snowfall differences in those couple fluff storms per season that favor the western slopes (ie. upslope events with low inversions so the moisture isn't able to make it to the Stowe side). This is when Underhill also gets the majority of its snowfall difference. Upslope events with higher inversions deposit more snow on the Stowe side than the Underhill side, however, J.Spin's favorable location in the middle of the Spine means his location gets in on both types of events. So it appears as though western slope favored events are primarily the main snowfall difference between Stowe Village and Waterbury, and since those events are often big fluff, low water events, the actual liquid differences between J.Spin's and the Stowe Village CoCoRAHS are quite small.

2) Also looking over some BTV daily climate maps of our area, and some of my observations, those events that are mostly only western slope events, often have massive gradients on the Stowe side of the mountain (ie. very low amounts at Stowe village CoCoRAHS, but my High Road/Barnes Camp snow boards show similar amounts to what you and Underhill get). Those events have large gradients along the Mountain Road in Stowe, as there are several days where I noticed significantly more snow at Topnotch than I did back at home a few miles down the road.

3) The Stowe area does a heck of a lot better than the western slope communities in any sort of synoptic SE flow event. Massive downsloping into Underhill/Nashville/Jerhico/Richmond/Jonesville/Huntington often show those areas with little if any snow in those events. Unfortunately, they usually aren't high ratio events but high liquid. This is what usually puts Stowe over Underhill in terms of total winter QPF, but in SE flow, 1" of QPF means 10" of snow, instead of NW flow where 1" liquid means 30" of snow, so Underhill takes the nod in total snowfall. Again, J.Spin's location is in the middle of the Spine, so he looks to do similar to Stowe liquid wise in SE flow events. J.Spin's comments in a lot of his reports also show this as he'll have 7" overnight and then find 1-2" in Richmond which got downsloped on any easterly component wind.

4) Snowfall measuring techniques, mechanism for snowfall (upslope vs synoptic), and loft/flake type make probably the biggest differences in snowfall in this area. This was just one 5-day period in January that popped out when I was looking over the 2010-2011 winter stats. The Stowe Village CoCoRAHS had more total liquid but 5" less snowfall. Looking back at J.Spin's website of this time period and event, it looks like there was some upslope fluff at the backside of the storm that bumped up snowfall on the 12th/13th on west slope spots.

Here are the maps from that first event from January 13, 2011... looks like widespread QPF near 1" in this area on both east and west sides of the Spine, but likely end of the storm fluff took final totals a tick higher on the west side. You can see even south of I-89 on the west slopes, there are stations like Hanksville and Lincoln that received much less QPF (0.66-0.85") but picked up more snow (11-14"). These types of micro-scale differences are what I love about this area. It all comes down to flake type, how sheltered your location is from wind, and if you are getting the bulk of your snow from NW flow on the backside, or SE flow on the frontside.

Lastly, going back and looking at 2009-2010, I could only compare January 24, 2010 onward because that was when Waterbury 3.0NW started reporting to CoCoRAHS.

But again I found that from January 24 - April 15, 2010 (the second half of winter), Stowe Village and Waterbury 3.0NW were within 0.05" of liquid of each other. To have almost 3 months and the precipitation differences are again only 5 one-hundredths!

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powderfreak

powderfreak

Posted
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I'm up in Norway now where it doesn't get dark until 1130pm...and then its light out again at 3am. it's pretty cool to see the parks still packed right now at 10:30pm with folks laying out on blankets, playing soccer and frisbee, grilling, etc and carrying on like it's early afternoon. Then you look at your watch and see its 1030pm...and yet still another solid hour till it gets dark.

It would be interesting to live with this solar cycle. I was at a ski area today and all the trails had lights...I figured they had night skiing but instead its because you need lights as there's only light from like 10am-2pm in the dead of winter. That would be rough...and further north in the country, there's 24 hour darkness/light depending on time of year. Very interesting to live somewhere with such wild solar swings.

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