WNCwx Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Last night was the most intense hailstorm I've ever been through. It sounded like a dump truck was dumping gravel on the house. Here are some photos and a short video clip I shot last night. The power went off before I could post them last night. This was the first cell that came over Macon County that had produced a tornado in Chattanooga and a possible tornado in Murphy, NC. I live about 3 miles Northeast of Franklin, NC: First, there was lightning... The there was hail... Short video clip I shot out in the middle of my field. I stayed there through the lightning, but ran away when I heard the hail coming. That sound really freaked me out in the dark... It doesn't sound like there was much damage in Macon County other than a few trees and power lines blown over. If you have headphones, crank up the volume and listen to the thunder. It was nearly continuous for a few minutes before the hail hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solak Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 The town of Murphy, NC was hit hard by the weather on Friday night. Murphy is located in Cherokee County. Crews will be out all morning assessing the damage. Officials say that strong winds damaged a lot of businesses. Power crews are out attempting to help get the lights back on to all the homes that are without power, no word on how many homes that could be. Several roads are blocked in the area. The American Red Cross in Greenville says that they are sending a crew to NC to assist the victims of the destruction. According to Brian Scoles with the American Red Cross a they do not know an exact number of homes destroyed because emergency are attempting to go through the rubble. Right now the estimate is 20 homes destroyed. A shelter has been set up for victims at Peach Tree Fire Department, 155 Upper Peach Tree Road, Murphy, NC. If you are looking for a family member you can go to a web site set up by the American Red Cross called Safe and Well. Click here to access the website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheronNC Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 How did NWS GSP let the tornadic spin-up that went through NE Charlotte at 2:30 a.m. go unwarned? We had that sharp wedge boundary lying across Charlotte with temps. of 52 (with NE winds) versus 69 (with SW winds) within 3 or 4 miles. We also had a line of thunderstorms carrying 50 mph straight-line winds then traverse that boundary. The setup was textbook for a quick spin-up, and they should've at least had a SVR TS warning out for it and watched it like a hawk given it was over the most populated metro. area within their jurisdiction. Signature clearly showed on radar: and local mets. were on top of things tweeting about it. I remember when living in NWS Raleigh territory, they were always extremely wary of sharp wedge boundaries when t-storms moved over them and would be on a hair trigger to issue warnings. Given NWS GSP's propensity for issuing junk severe t-storm warnings for every convective cell that develops in rural areas/over the mountains during the summer months, for a nighttime event like this over a 2 million+ populated area to go unwarned is puzzling. People whose homes are damaged this morning are saying their wx radios never went off, and no, they wouldn't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheronNC Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Slideshow of the damage from the overnight Charlotte tornado: http://www.wsoctv.com/gallery/news/local/slideshow-storm-damage-east-meck-co/gdzB/#1333063 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jburns Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 After looking at the photos, I have to say that the NWS screwed the pooch on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkman Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 After looking at the photos, I have to say that the NWS screwed the pooch on this one. I think we can probably all agree that the GSP office is not on the same level as RAH for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcworthWx Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I think we can probably all agree that the GSP office is not on the same level as RAH for whatever reason. I don't think this is under GSP's CWA. Wouldn't it be more under CLT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downeastnc Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I don't think this is under GSP's CWA. Wouldn't it be more under CLT? No Charlotte is under NWS office in GSP there is no NWS office in CLT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcworthWx Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 No Charlotte is under NWS office in GSP there is no NWS office in CLT. Thanks for the clarification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downeastnc Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Slideshow of the damage from the overnight Charlotte tornado: http://www.wsoctv.co...o/gdzB/#1333063 Just released from GSP NOUS42 KGSP 032110 PNSGSP GAZ010-017-018-026-028-029-NCZ033-035>037-048>053-056>059-062>065- 068>072-082-501>510-SCZ001>014-019-040500- PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE GREENVILLE-SPARTANBURG SC 410 PM EST SAT MAR 3 2012 ...TORNADO CONFIRMED NEAR 9 ENE CHARLOTTE IN MECKLENBURG AND CABARRUS COUNTIES IN NORTH CAROLINA... LOCATION...9 ENE CHARLOTTE IN MECKLENBURG COUNTY NORTH CAROLINA DATE...MARCH 3 2012 ESTIMATED TIME...234 AM EST MAXIMUM EF-SCALE RATING...EF2 ESTIMATED MAXIMUM WIND SPEED...130 TO 135 MPH MAXIMUM PATH WIDTH...150 TO 200 YARDS PATH LENGTH...3.8 MILES BEGINNING LAT/LON...35.26N / 80.68W ENDING LAT/LON...35.27N / 80.64W * FATALITIES...0 * INJURIES...3 * THE INFORMATION IN THIS STATEMENT IS PRELIMINARY AND SUBJECT TO CHANGE PENDING FINAL REVIEW OF THE EVENT(S) AND PUBLICATION IN NWS STORM DATA. ...SUMMARY... THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN GREENVILLE-SPARTANBURG SC HAS CONFIRMED A TORNADO NEAR 9 ENE CHARLOTTE IN MECKLENBURG COUNTY NORTH CAROLINA ON MARCH 3 2012. THIS EF2 TORNADO WITH MAXIMUM WINDS UP TO 135 MPH TOUCHED DOWN NEAR FAIRES ROAD IN EASTERN MECKLENBURG COUNTY AROUND 234 AM EST. THE TORNADO TRACKED 3.8 MILES TO THE EAST NORTHEAST INTO CABARRUS COUNTY BEFORE LIFTING NEAR ROBINSON CHURCH AND PEACH ORCHARD ROADS NEAR HARRISBURG. THIS INFORMATION CAN ALSO BE FOUND ON OUR WEBSITE AT WEATHER.GOV/GSP. FOR REFERENCE...THE ENHANCED FUJITA SCALE CLASSIFIES TORNADOES INTO THE FOLLOWING CATEGORIES: EF0...WIND SPEEDS 65 TO 85 MPH. EF1...WIND SPEEDS 86 TO 110 MPH. EF2...WIND SPEEDS 111 TO 135 MPH. EF3...WIND SPEEDS 136 TO 165 MPH. EF4...WIND SPEEDS 166 TO 200 MPH. EF5...WIND SPEEDS GREATER THAN 200 MPH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcworthWx Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I put this in the thread on the Main wxside, but I'll stick it in here as well. This is for Haralson County, GA and still waiting on the report for Paulding County. PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE PEACHTREE CITY GA 255 PM EST SAT MAR 3 2012 ...PRELIMINARY TORNADO REPORT FOR MARCH 2 2012... LOCATION: HARALSON COUNTY RATING: EF-3 WIND SPEED: 165 MPH PRELIMINARY INFORMATION IS THAT AN EF3 TORNADO TOUCHED DOWN IN HARALSON COUNTY WITH EF3 DAMAGE ALONG BETHLEHEM CHURCH ROAD WHERE A REPAIR SHOP WAS DESTROYED AND NUMEROUS TREES WERE DOWNED. OTHER DAMAGE IN HARALSON COUNTY INCLUDED A METAL ROOF BLOWN OFF A MOBILE HOME...A CHURCH STEEPLE BLOWN OFF ON MOUNT ZION EAST ROAD...A MOBILE HOME PUSHED OF ITS FOUNDATION ALONG BETHLEHEM CHURCH ROAD...AND IN THE VICINITY OF HIGHWAY 27 AND HARPERS CREEK ROAD NUMEROUS TREES AND TELEPHONE POLES WERE SNAPPED. THIS WILL CONTINUE TO BE UPDATED AS ADDITIONAL INFORMATION BECOMES AVAILABLE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC_hailstorm Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 There was no TOR or even a SVR warning on the Mecklenburg/Cabarrus storm here in N.C. The GSP radar could'nt pick up an EF2 but the Raleigh guys saw it when it entered Stanly Co. on the fringe of their forecast area and warned it. I-77 corrider is on the fringe of both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkman Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 RAH actually warned Stanley County long before the storm got there. I guess they were trying to do all they could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solak Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Quite a summary on the Charlotte/Mecklenburg Co. EF2 tornado... https://nwschat.weather.gov/p.php?pid=201203040039-KGSP-NOUS42-PNSGSP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteoutWX Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 There was no TOR or even a SVR warning on the Mecklenburg/Cabarrus storm here in N.C. The GSP radar could'nt pick up an EF2 but the Raleigh guys saw it when it entered Stanly Co. on the fringe of their forecast area and warned it. I-77 corrider is on the fringe of both. It's troubling the GSP radar is essentially blind right over top of GSPs most populated city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theodometer Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 It's troubling the GSP radar is essentially blind right over top of GSPs most populated city. What about the terminal doppler at CLT, though? Couldn't they have used it to pick it up--or does it have some limitations in times like that? Just curious--because I had the same thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcworthWx Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Has anyone seen a PNS out of FFC about the damage in Paulding County, GA? They put one out for Haralson County, GA rather quickly, but haven't been able to find one for Paulding(which actually sustained more damage). Would the weekend be hampering the survey crew from surveying the area or lack of multiple survey crews? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheronNC Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 What about the terminal doppler at CLT, though? Couldn't they have used it to pick it up--or does it have some limitations in times like that? Just curious--because I had the same thought... The CLT terminal doppler is what picked up the clear and crystal couplet signature I had posted earlier. No reason that they wouldn't have been using this at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheronNC Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Charlotte Observer article interviewing a met. at NWS GSP about the event suggests that they continue to have their heads buried in the sand: http://www.charlotte...he-type-of.html Here are some key snippets: "I haven't seen the radar returns, but some of the other people here in the office say the line of storms formed a bow," [Meteorologist Harry Gerapetritis] said, referring to a phenomenon that often signals severe wind damage. Well, not exactly. It had a bow-echo type structure as it entered Mecklenburg County, but as you can see below, it evolved into a bit more than a "bow" when it hit the wedge front - "Forecasters said another complication with the Charlotte-area forecast Friday and early Saturday was the location of a cold air wedge -- a pocket of cool and rather stable air that was locked in place over the western Carolinas. Forecasters had expected a warm front to push northward, out of South Carolina, up toward the Interstate 40 corridor. When that happened, they expected the Charlotte area to be in an unstable air pattern, at risk for severe thunderstorms and tornadoes. When the warm front never pushed into Charlotte, meteorologists decided not to include Mecklenburg, Cabarrus and Union counties in a tornado watch that was issued late Friday night, for the overnight hours." Actually, arguably the most important place for a watch was where the wedge boundary was, which happened to transect Mecklenburg and Cabarrus County at the time. Part of Charlotte WAS in the unstable airmass, and that's kind of the point. You had a 15-degree temperature contrast with opposite wind directions within a 3-4 mile distance. The above characterization by NWS GSP suggests that they remain shockingly clueless as to some of the typical local features that North Carolina tends to experience, where often times the greatest danger of tornados is along a wedge boundary if thunderstorms move over them. It's one thing to have missed the event as it was occurring - it's another altogether to claim after the event that the situation was like "trying to find a needle in a haystack" when there should have been red flags all over this setup. "He said in situations like this, meteorologists review what happened, look at the data, and discuss what they might have done differently. "The next time, we try to get it right," he said. The studies out of NCState in conjunction with NWS Raleigh about wedge boundaries and severe weather has been out about 20 years. This is not a new revelation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperNET Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Anyone from GSP that can provide an explanation? Everyone knows were all human and we make mistakes but we (the community) in which you serve should be giving a reasonable answer. I'm not being critical, but the GSP I know is way better than this, and is constantly rated as one of the top preforming WFO's in the country. Fortunately, know body was killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyewall Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 http://www.wbtv.com/...rious-questions From the article: However, what makes this past weekend's tornado and the lack of a warning concerning, is the NWS in Raleigh had clearly detected a doppler-indicated tornado over Mecklenburg county. They said so in a warning they issued for Stanly County regarding that same tornado at 2:40am. Oddly, Stanly county is 14 miles east of that location, and on the other side of our neighboring county of Cabarrus. So why would the Raleigh NWS issue a tornado warning for Stanly county, but not Mecklenburg or Cabarrus since they knew it was there, and they knew it had to cross Cabarrus to get to Stanly? Answer: Because those two counties are not in their zone; only the GSP NWS can issue those warnings. Yet they didn't. Why? Well that is the big question. One would expect that adjacent NWS offices are coordinating with each other, but it seems hard to believe that was the case here. Even if the two offices didn't communicate prior to the warning, wouldn't alarms go off if a weather office issues a tornado warning by pinpointing a tornado in YOUR zone? How is it that GSP sat on the sideline while Raleigh sent out a bulletin pinpointing a doppler-indicated tornado in their zone? It's one thing to miss a radar signature and therefore miss a tornado. But in this case GSP either missed, or ignored Raleigh's tornado warning and the fact Raleigh has spotted a tornado in GSP's zone. Something is seriously amiss here. My purpose is not to condemn either NWS office, but instead to raise questions and ask for an explanation. It doesn't make sense that one office is publicly broadcasting a tornado radar sighting while the other NWS office, the one which is actually responsible for it, is doing nothing. Let's hope we get some answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozart Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 The Queen City ought to have its own WFO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theodometer Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Brad Panovich more or less agrees: http://wxbrad.com/?p=3055 From his post: "It’s really easy to blame the National Weather Service for not issuing a Tornado warning for Cabarrus County. I don’t think there was time to warn for Mecklenburg due to how fast the tornado spun up. Clearly they are second guessing the process down at the NWS in GSP. I will explain why this happened in a minute, but to me there was no excuse why there shouldn’t have been a Severe Thunderstorm warning in place for Charlotte and Mecklenburg County" Also thought his point about the initial cell to move through York County and into Gaston and Mecklenburg Counties moving the wedge further north was quite important. Personally, it likely made a huge difference for me--but importantly, it placed that wedge into Mecklenburg County where it might have been south of there otherwise. I know (as I stated earlier) we (in Northern Rock Hill) went up from 57 at 5 to 67 at 11. It was a huge worry for me. I think GSP got caught there--as they didn't think the boundary would move that far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcworthWx Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 The Queen City ought to have its own WFO. That is very True, but we all know how that would work out for those residents. In this economy, with the tax coffers w/minimum funds and with possible cutbacks in NWS, you're hard pressed to see anything of this nature. It is rather odd, at least to me, that they have a WFO in a one state forecasting another state. Is there another WFO in the country that does this as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theodometer Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 That is very True, but we all know how that would work out for those residents. In this economy, with the tax coffers w/minimum funds and with possible cutbacks in NWS, you're hard pressed to see anything of this nature. It is rather odd, at least to me, that they have a WFO in a one state forecasting another state. Is there another WFO in the country that does this as well? Actually, GSP does 3 states--NE Ga., Upstate of SC, and Western NC up to Charlotte. Think about it, they have to deal with the microclimates of the Mountains and the foothills, as well as large parts of the Piedmont. That's what makes this so shocking to me--they usually get it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozart Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 It is rather odd, at least to me, that they have a WFO in a one state forecasting another state. Is there another WFO in the country that does this as well? Oh sure. The office in Goodland, KS forecasts for counties in three different states. But Charlotte is North Carolina's largest city, and having its WFO be so peripheral is just not an optimum situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaculaWeather Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 That is very True, but we all know how that would work out for those residents. In this economy, with the tax coffers w/minimum funds and with possible cutbacks in NWS, you're hard pressed to see anything of this nature. It is rather odd, at least to me, that they have a WFO in a one state forecasting another state. Is there another WFO in the country that does this as well? Yes, there are quite a few like that. South Georgia is covered by two different offices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isopycnic Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 I always thought gsp and columbia were too close together. GSP's should be in charlotte or Asheville, iMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaculaWeather Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I know WFO's will at times help each other out during busy periods, that's also a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavarreDon Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Some info on the Murphy, NC tornado. 000 NOUS44 KMRX 032219 PNSMRX PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE MORRISTOWN TN 515 PM EST SAT MARCH 3 2012 ...EF-2 TORNADO CONFIRMED IN MURPHY...NORTH CAROLINA IN CHEROKEE COUNTY... A STORM SURVEY TEAM FROM THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE HAS COMPLETED AN ASSESSMENT OF TORNADO DAMAGE THAT OCCURRED MARCH 2ND IN CHEROKEE COUNTY NORTH CAROLINA. THE TORNADO THAT PRODUCED DAMAGE IN CHEROKEE COUNTY...OCCURRED IN THE CITY OF MURPHY. THE TORNADO WAS RATED AS AN EF-2 WITH MAXIMUM WINDS AT 120 MILES AN HOUR. THE TORNADO PRODUCE MODERATE TO MAJOR DAMAGE TO SEVERAL BUSINESS AND DAMAGE TO A FEW HOMES. THE STORM SURVEY WAS CONDUCTED BY: GEORGE MATHEWS...METEOROLOGIST IN CHARGE...AND DOUG SCHNEIDER...SENIOR FORECASTER...WITH THE MORRISTOWN TENNESSEE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE OFFICE. http://www.citizen-times.com/article/20120304/NEWS/303040044/2-Cherokee-County-schools-closed-Monday-wake-twister?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Frontpage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.