Winter 2001-2002 vs Winter 2011-2012

[Riptide]

Don't recall 2001 very well, aside from the spring-like summer warmth. Honestly, this winter ranks the lowest since I started tracking weather. I honestly thought nothing could ever surpass 2007-2008 in terms of fail in my area. My seasonal total was 7 inches that winter and it looks like I will barely break 1 inch this winter. Something is fundamentally screwed up with the climate, and it's not global warming. (look at Europe, arctic temperature anomalies).

Or mabye I'm just spoiled by the snowmageddon...

[Riptide]

I know that the late 90's featured some really putrid winters, but I did not live in New Jersey at the time. It's possible that the Eastern US was simply due for another rainstorm winter.

[Ottawa Blizzard]

This winter has been the biggest bust I have ever experienced. Even 2001-2002 had a big snow event for my area at the end of January. This has honestly been my generation's version of 1931-32.

[famartin]

Don't recall 2001 very well, aside from the spring-like summer warmth. Honestly, this winter ranks the lowest since I started tracking weather. I honestly thought nothing could ever surpass 2007-2008 in terms of fail in my area. My seasonal total was 7 inches that winter and it looks like I will barely break 1 inch this winter. Something is fundamentally screwed up with the climate, and it's not global warming. (look at Europe, arctic temperature anomalies).

Or mabye I'm just spoiled by the snowmageddon...

Cape May has had quite a few winters in the last 40 years with 5" or less total snowfall...

1998-99

1997-98

1996-97

1994-95

1991-92

1980-81

1975-76

1974-75

1972-73

That's almost 10 winters in 40, or almost a 25% chance, of 5" or less total winter snowfall!

[isohume]

I have enjoyed this winter immensely. It's a well deserved payback winter.

[GaWx]

2001-2 was a great winter for KATL with over double the climo avg. of snow and the best snow then since 1992-3. So, as of now, it is no contest.

[ORH_wxman]

This "winter" has been worse than 2001-2002 here, however, the October snow blitz of 19" is a unique aspect that makes it a bit easier to take...even though it was removed from the winter months. I'd have to see how the rest of winter goes before judging this one though. March can be a big snow month here...if it fails to produce then it will definitely end up worse than '01-'02 at least for DJFM....but that winter wasn't the bottom of the barrel anyway. '99-'00 was worse here and winters like '88-89 and '94-'95 were terrible as well.

[Amped]

This "winter" has been worse than 2001-2002 here, however, the October snow blitz of 19" is a unique aspect that makes it a bit easier to take...even though it was removed from the winter months. I'd have to see how the rest of winter goes before judging this one though. March can be a big snow month here...if it fails to produce then it will definitely end up worse than '01-'02 at least for DJFM....but that winter wasn't the bottom of the barrel anyway. '99-'00 was worse here and winters like '88-89 and '94-'95 were terrible as well.

Those we're all nothing. If you wanna see a bad winter move to DCA. We can't even cover the grass.

[ORH_wxman]

Those we're all nothing. If you wanna see a bad winter move to DCA. We can't even cover the grass.

Its all relative...I'm sure DCA people think a decent winter in Norfolk stinks.

[buckeye]

I think in the expectation vs. reality dept....2011-12 might be the king of disappointment. I don't recall what the preseason forecasts for 01-02 were, but I know the VAST MAJORITY of winter calls for this year were for a really good winter. Especially in my region, the OV, where weak la nina's can be infamous producers of app runners and lake cutters.

Enso as a predominant forecasting tool for upcoming weather patterns lost a lot of cred in my book.

[Brian5671]

Both were very similiar in my area--warmth, little in the way of storminess, and one moderate snow event in January.both were

forecatr to be decent winters, especially 01-02...both featured models calling for pattern changes that never came...

[Harry]

I think in the expectation vs. reality dept....2011-12 might be the king of disappointment. I don't recall what the preseason forecasts for 01-02 were, but I know the VAST MAJORITY of winter calls for this year were for a really good winter. Especially in my region, the OV, where weak la nina's can be infamous producers of app runners and lake cutters.

Enso as a predominant forecasting tool for upcoming weather patterns lost a lot of cred in my book.

I seem to recall a few going big in 2001-02 as well. For me personally ( i was at the DE coast for 01-02 ) this winter gets the edge. For this area 2001-02 blows this winter away as that had about 90" on the season when all was said and done and i don't see that happening this year. 01-02 had a epic LES event in late Dec, Nice late Jan/Early Feb and then a decent March.

[Amped]

Its all relative...I'm sure DCA people think a decent winter in Norfolk stinks.

And in the Cascades they say " I'm totally screwed I only got 550" this season."

And I feel no sympathy.

[Geos]

I'll take 01-02 winter over any other winter I've experienced lately! At least that winter has longer stretches of cold and more snow each month of the winter. This winter is epic - bad!

[Riptide]

Cape May has had quite a few winters in the last 40 years with 5" or less total snowfall...

1998-99

1997-98

1996-97

1994-95

1991-92

1980-81

1975-76

1974-75

1972-73

That's almost 10 winters in 40, or almost a 25% chance, of 5" or less total winter snowfall!

Limited sample range but still viable information, it's not exactly a snowy climate being in the subtropics.

[snowstormcanuck]

This winter has been the biggest bust I have ever experienced. Even 2001-2002 had a big snow event for my area at the end of January. This has honestly been my generation's version of 1931-32.

Yeah. Assuming nothing changes (which is a pretty big assumption), this winter is in essentially 2001-02 without the lone snowstorm, thereby allowing it to surpass 2001-02 on the hall of shame rankings.

2009-10 is stil king of crap though. We'd have to be in spring weather from here on out for 2011-12 to touch 2009-10.

[RutgersWx92]

Since I was relatively young during 01-02 and thus barely remember it, this winter will definitely go down as the worst winter I have ever experienced since I really started tracking the weather. I thought 06-07 and 07-08 were pretty bad, but I would have gladly taken those winters over this one. At least in those winters there were actually some big storms to track and we got some snow (as well as an extended period of cold in February 2007). There has been virtually nothing to track for months now; just 40's and 50's with very little precip for weeks upon weeks. I honestly don't know if I can think of a more boring long stretch of weather as it has been here since November. And it's not just here; the weather has been exceedingly boring, warm, and snowless for much of North America for the most part (outside of Alaska).

Looking back on how 01-02 was here versus 11-12, they look very similar (both in terms of temps, precip, and the minor snowfall in January), however the October storm helps to give this winter the slight edge over that one. I would rank the DJF's on the same level though.

[famartin]

Since I was relatively young during 01-02 and thus barely remember it, this winter will definitely go down as the worst winter I have ever experienced since I really started tracking the weather. I thought 06-07 and 07-08 were pretty bad, but I would have gladly taken those winters over this one. At least in those winters there were actually some big storms to track and we got some snow (as well as an extended period of cold in February 2007). There has been virtually nothing to track for months now; just 40's and 50's with very little precip for weeks upon weeks. I honestly don't know if I can think of a more boring long stretch of weather as it has been here since November. And it's not just here; the weather has been exceedingly boring, warm, and snowless for much of North America for the most part (outside of Alaska).

Looking back on how 01-02 was here versus 11-12, they look very similar (both in terms of temps, precip, and the minor snowfall in January), however the October storm helps to give this winter the slight edge over that one. I would rank the DJF's on the same level though.

Comparisons for NB:

Temps

WINTER   OCT  NOV  DEC  JAN  FEB  MAR  APR
2001-02 55.7 48.9 41.5 37.2 38.3 42.8 54.5
2006-07 53.6 49.3 42.4 36.6 26.4 40.8 48.0
2007-08 62.4 43.6 35.5 34.5 34.6 41.1 52.7
2011-12 56.6 49.0 40.7 34.7 ???? ???? ????

Snow

WINTER   OCT  NOV  DEC  JAN  FEB  MAR  APR TOTAL
2001-02  0.0  0.0  0.0  4.0  0.1  1.4  0.0   5.5
2006-07  0.0  0.0  0.0  3.3  1.8  5.6  0.0  10.7
2007-08  0.0  0.0  2.5  0.6  6.4  0.4  0.0   9.9
2011-12  3.0  0.0  0.0  3.1  0.9  ???  ???   7.0

[SnowGoose69]

I seem to recall a few going big in 2001-02 as well. For me personally ( i was at the DE coast for 01-02 ) this winter gets the edge. For this area 2001-02 blows this winter away as that had about 90" on the season when all was said and done and i don't see that happening this year. 01-02 had a epic LES event in late Dec, Nice late Jan/Early Feb and then a decent March.

Everyone went cold and snowy in 01-02, they all fell into the neutral ENSO trap. What alot of people fail to realize though is neutral winters can be dangerous in the absence of a -NAO and especially a -AO. The Pacific often determines the fate of neutral winters, if its bad sometimes even the -NAO/AO will not help, if the Pac setup is favorable the U.S. can do quite well as far as snow and cold. Neutral ENSOs following El Ninos also are better than ones following La Ninas because you can often have some presence of an STJ, 01-02 came following over 3 years without an El Nino, that undoubtedly contributed largely to the overall dry nature to the pattern that winter for the country. 1981-82 was a good example of a cold neutral winter but the fact we had gone 3-4 years with no El Nino basically resulted in many places seeing below normal precipitation. This would be my big concern heading into 2012-2013, I think we have a good chance to resume our -NAO/AO next winter but if we do not go into a weak El Nino it may be bone dry across the country.

[brad1551]

Snowgoose 69,

I agree on your post totally. It is a close call for a neutral or weak El Nino next winter so far. I know one thing, back to back La Nina"s followed by a west based El Nino sometimes rock out on the east coast.

[Snowstorms]

Yeah. Assuming nothing changes (which is a pretty big assumption), this winter is in essentially 2001-02 without the lone snowstorm, thereby allowing it to surpass 2001-02 on the hall of shame rankings.

2009-10 is stil king of crap though. We'd have to be in spring weather from here on out for 2011-12 to touch 2009-10.

If I had to choose between 2009-10, this year and 2001-02, I'd choose 2001-02 hands down. These three winters and 06-07 are the most worst winters this century thus far and perhaps, of all time.

But that early April storm in 2002 wasnt bad. I got about 4" before it rained lol. As for temps, this Winter has been colder. The summer of 2002 was warm but then again, it was transitioning towards a Nino. I think this spring/summer may end up like 2000. Lets see.

[Harry]

Everyone went cold and snowy in 01-02, they all fell into the neutral ENSO trap. What alot of people fail to realize though is neutral winters can be dangerous in the absence of a -NAO and especially a -AO. The Pacific often determines the fate of neutral winters, if its bad sometimes even the -NAO/AO will not help, if the Pac setup is favorable the U.S. can do quite well as far as snow and cold. Neutral ENSOs following El Ninos also are better than ones following La Ninas because you can often have some presence of an STJ, 01-02 came following over 3 years without an El Nino, that undoubtedly contributed largely to the overall dry nature to the pattern that winter for the country. 1981-82 was a good example of a cold neutral winter but the fact we had gone 3-4 years with no El Nino basically resulted in many places seeing below normal precipitation. This would be my big concern heading into 2012-2013, I think we have a good chance to resume our -NAO/AO next winter but if we do not go into a weak El Nino it may be bone dry across the country.

I think you meant 80-81? As that was a *dry* stinker for most of the country with neutral enso conditions. 81-82 was not to bad for much of the MW/GL/ and eastcoast.. This ofcourse though had alot of cold and snow into March and April.

[Alpha5]

01-02 was worse.

Less snow and no October HECS.

Even if I got under 5" for DJF, the historical nature of the october storm makes up for it

[brad1551]

Let's just hope we all follow with a 2002-2003 winter on the east coast. I will slowly start too speculate on next winter come September- October 2012. Untill then may everyone enjoy the warm months to come.

[greg ralls]

I guess I'd go with 2001-02 as being a little more hated. At least the current winter comes on the heels of two incredible winters in my back yard, so I don't feel the same sort of snow starvation I remember feeling that winter.

[GaWx]

Just to remind folks, 2001-2 was the winter for which the GFS' cold bias was the worst. This was the first winter after the 5/2001 major GFS mod. that cooled the model to reduce false tropical cyclone formations. Although they were successfully reduced, a good number of week two runs went off the deep end and were ridiculously cold...a number of runs had historic cold waves. So, from that aspect, it was a good bit more "exciting" for folks buying into the GFS (then called MRF/AVN).

[MJO812]

This winter was the worst. All the false storms on the models that never came true.

[snowstormcanuck]

Yeah. Assuming nothing changes (which is a pretty big assumption), this winter is in essentially 2001-02 without the lone snowstorm, thereby allowing it to surpass 2001-02 on the hall of shame rankings.

2009-10 is stil king of crap though. We'd have to be in spring weather from here on out for 2011-12 to touch 2009-10.

And that's basically what's going to happen. Please be seated on the throne 2011-12.

[BullCityWx]

01-02 was better.

[michsnowfreak]

For sure 2011-12 was worse, but we really were due for such a sh*tty year. When you are averaging 2 feet of snow above average for 5 years running, somethings gotta cave or an average is not an average anymore. Though we did not see snow futility here that so many others did, it still was a very, VERY disappointing winter.

In 2011-12, Ive only had 25.4" of snow and 20 days with 1"+ snow on the ground. My previous least snowy winter (since I began measuring in 1995) was 1997-98 with 27.2", and the least amount of snowcover days were 2001-02 with 35 days. While I think 2011-12 had more days with a T depth than 2001-02, thats splitting hairs. Since I started personal record-keeping in 1995, nothing can touch this season for amount of time the ground was not fully snowcovered. 20 days, after 81 days last winter, is atrocious. PLUS, this is coming after a string of immensely snowy winters, whereas 2001-02 was not. So its even harder to swallow, though arguably we were certainly more overdue for such a winter this year. And of course, both years had cold/snowy forecasts.

In a historical context, both winters rank high for warmth at Detroit (2001-02 the 5th, 2011-12 the 6th), but neither even made the top 20 least snowy winters list.