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Feb 11/12 Storm Disco II


Baroclinic Zone

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This is a storm that should be right up Messenger's alley. he does his best analysis on storms like this..and judging by his posts he thinks it's coming west

Kev thanks, I did, little wobbly after the 18z GFS/RGEM. It's too soon to tell if they're legitimately onto something.

GFS had some glaring QPF issues in the south on the 18z, I have a hard time going along with it. RGEM wasn't much better.

The RUC and WV both continue to confirm we've got a more formidable s/w than models expected. There's also the issue of the max that's apparently going to initiate the low which does have the capability of playing the role of the TT patented cosmic dildo.

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This is a storm that should be right up Messenger's alley. he does his best analysis on storms like this..and judging by his posts he thinks it's coming west

I really dont see the 84 cooridor getting shut out from this despite crappy output recently. I can see you squeaking out 2" if things break right. SE CT should see atleast 3". If I was in the Litchfield hills I'd be worried for a dusting or less.

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I might be pulling a Kev, but come on. People are jumping ship after an off hour GFS run and RGEM run? First of all, the RGEM seems to always bail last second, second of all, the 12z EURO looked good for those east of ORH.

I'm going to enjoy my 3" of snow. Coastalwx and weathafella will enjoy their 4". Bob to messenger will enjoy their 6". Hopefully Phil can get 5" of paste.

MPM/mrg - 1"

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I might be pulling a Kev, but come on. People are jumping ship after an off hour GFS run and RGEM run? First of all, the RGEM seems to always bail last second, second of all, the 12z EURO looked good for those east of ORH.

I'm going to enjoy my 3" of snow. Coastalwx and weathafella will enjoy their 4". Bob to messenger will enjoy their 6". Hopefully Phil can get 5" of paste.

MPM/mrg - 1"

I think the Berks will see some as well, because theres the front coming from the NW and there'll be some LL moisture. Most of CNE/NNE will see some surprise 1-2" amounts.

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hopefully that precip over MD/DE comes up and saturates these low dew-points, then sets us up for later on....

Saw your comment, was looking at the Euro. It seemed to do pretty well down there today in LA.

When looking at the strength at 5h, was very good there too. At closer look, the surface is a bit funky. We have the Euro also trying to spawn the low WAY to the SE under the convection.... a struggle takes place and then a low pops off the Carolinas. Without that we're toast for a more serious event.

If we did not have that 3rd s/w complex none of this is an issue, we'd have the low take it's rightful place much closer to Hatteras. As it is, I would still think we're seeing some type of loop in the models and that we're pretty much on course.

EDIT: Frankly there's nothing to make me believe the shift in the GFS/RGEM are anything more than off hour feedback. JMHO for now.

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I really dont see the 84 cooridor getting shut out from this despite crappy output recently. I can see you squeaking out 2" if things break right. SE CT should see atleast 3". If I was in the Litchfield hills I'd be worried for a dusting or less.

That is my thinking, and has been since Wednesday. Leading the charge was the 12z EURO from yesterday.

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hey all, greetings from loon, actually good skiing conditions... and so wish I had better internet so I could track/discuss along with everyone

will be driving with the fam back to Boston Saturday evening, hoping to be pleasantly surprised

appreciate all the analysis, can't access any model runs

post-3106-132891339177.jpg

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Saw your comment, was looking at the Euro. It seemed to do pretty well down there today in LA.

When looking at the strength at 5h, was very good there too. At closer look, the surface is a bit funky. We have the Euro also trying to spawn the low WAY to the SE under the convection.... a struggle takes place and then a low pops off the Carolinas. Without that we're toast for a more serious event.

If we did not have that 3rd s/w complex none of this is an issue, we'd have the low take it's rightful place much closer to Hatteras. As it is, I would still think we're seeing some type of loop in the models and that we're pretty much on course.

EDIT: Frankly there's nothing to make me believe the shift in the GFS/RGEM are anything more than off hour feedback. JMHO for now.

Just looking at the QPF fields, the difference is really only like 20-40 miles. Its hard to analyze something like this to within 20 mile (one county width basically) changes between runs. I think that's to be expected with the models.

Tonight will be filled with posts about how the low is 10 miles east or west of where it was progged. I think if the models get it to within a like 30 mile cone that's pretty decent given the resolution. Of course, in this situation, 20 miles makes a huge difference in SE Mass...like 3-4" vs 6-8"... but I think these 20-40 mile waffling is almost at the noise level given how complex the set-up is.

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That little feature is almost certainly the "low"....most of the models just kind of have it meandering up along the NC coast overnight, off HAT as a weak low that's poorly defined before starting to get its act together.

What is also interesting is toggling the 12z/18z GFS...the 12z may have been a bit too far NW with the moisture in the carolinas. It's really tough to tell, if you look along the VA/NC border you can see there are two distinct areas of moisture. The 12z had a mega bullseye right about where the I and N are in Dave's map on Kev's post. The 18z backed away from that a bit and shfited it SE. Certainly the 12z seems to have placed another erroneous bullseye.

The 18z GFS now has the moisture and the subsequent northern low in almost the identical spot to the 12z Euro at 9z tonight.

The 12z GFS is out on its ear, it's too far NW at 23z with the moisture and it's that moisture that it expanded NW over a lot of you later. I think that's going to be an error, the 18z backed away and it maches the euro much better and the current radar. sorry guys.

we need to watch the low on the NC coast as there's a chance it pops off earlier and saves the day. When you use some of the zoom sites to flip through the various models it's nuts how much of a battle is going on to pinpoint the low placement. The 12z GFS seems to have had placement issues again - near the convection.

In short there's zero reason right now to go against the Euro. It matches up very well with what has happened, what is happening, etc.

Dumping the 12z GFS is also supported by the 18z GFS ENS which with the NC blob removed is unable to ride as much moisture to the west right from the getgo.

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BASED ON A CONSENSUS OF WHERE THE

850-700MB FRONTOGENESIS AXIS WILL BE...AND A LACK OF STRONG OMEGA IN

THE SNOW GROWTH ZONE...BANDING/ENHANCED SNOWFALL RATES ARE NOT

ANTICIPATED. ANY BANDING POTENTIAL LOOKS LIKE IT WOULD BE JUST

OFFSHORE. HAVE GONE A FEW DEGREES BELOW GUIDANCE FOR TEMPERATURES

TONIGHT THROUGH SATURDAY.

LIQUID EQUIVALENT PRECIP IS FORECAST TO RANGE FROM AROUND 0.15 TO

0.50 INCHES...HIGHEST TO THE EAST. WITH EVERYTHING ELSE

CONSIDERED...LOOKING AT MOSTLY 1 OR 2 INCHES FOR THE CWA. WILL GO

WITH AN ADVISORY FOR PART OF SE CT AND FOR EASTERN SUFFOLK COUNTY

WHERE 2 TO 4 INCHES OF SNOW IS FORECAST.

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That little feature is almost certainly the "low"....most of the models just kind of have it meandering up along the NC coast overnight, off HAT as a weak low that's poorly defined before starting to get its act together.

What is also interesting is toggling the 12z/18z GFS...the 12z may have been a bit too far NW with the moisture in the carolinas. It's really tough to tell, if you look along the VA/NC border you can see there are two distinct areas of moisture. The 12z had a mega bullseye right about where the I and N are in Dave's map on Kev's post. The 18z backed away from that a bit and shfited it SE. Certainly the 12z seems to have placed another erroneous bullseye.

The 18z GFS now has the moisture and the subsequent northern low in almost the identical spot to the 12z Euro at 9z tonight.

The 12z GFS is out on its ear, it's too far NW at 23z with the moisture and it's that moisture that it expanded NW over a lot of you later. I think that's going to be an error, the 18z backed away and it maches the euro much better and the current radar. sorry guys.

we need to watch the low on the NC coast as there's a chance it pops off earlier and saves the day. When you use some of the zoom sites to flip through the various models it's nuts how much of a battle is going on to pinpoint the low placement. The 12z GFS seems to have had placement issues again - near the convection.

In short there's zero reason right now to go against the Euro. It matches up very well with what has happened, what is happening, etc.

Dumping the 12z GFS is also supported by the 18z GFS ENS which with the NC blob removed is unable to ride as much moisture to the west right from the getgo.

Since looking at 12z EURO yesterday, I have been in their camp, the HPC joined following the 0z Runs of today and has been there all day.

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http://radar.weather...1101111&loop=no

Low, a weak, maybe not quite closed low offshore of Georgetown. I think that is what becomes our "northern" low in a few hours. Would like to see the winds tighten up a bit around it, give it some definition, but I think that's it.

Winds have gone north in myrtle beach, we have a closed low approaching the obx.

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