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Feb 11/12 Storm Disco II


Baroclinic Zone

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i don't care what anyone says at this point; this nam solution IS convective feedback incarnate! that vmax is almost damped out of existence but then mysteriously comes back from the dead to somehow dent the isopleths - right. i bet it has a tornado producing meso right there too. bahahaha

100% in agreement

here is a good depiction of the SLP-fest produced by the southern stream, stochastic which of the SLPs takes off with feedback:

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I find that RGEM is fairly worthless in about 2/3 of systems. Maybe this isn't one of the times but just saying....

How many times have you known the RGEM to be surpressed? It'd usually have a low over Albany at about this stage.

The 0z NAM came towards the 18z GFS in a very noticeable way through the first 18-24 after which as it always does it reverts to it's old biases. That could spell bad news here in 20-30 minutes.

I don't think we can wave our hands and say it's entirely feedback. There's going to be a s/w out there, jet etc. There's going to be a surface reflection. This isn't totally spurious. Maybe the degree it's developing it is, but to characterize every model as having feedback on the same feature at the same time would have to be a historic event.

GFS will tell us which way it's going, like you Jerry I'd put more faith in it than the RGEM, but let's acknowledge that since 18z every model has shifted within itself SE.

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At this point I don't even care all too much as to where the surface low is going to track or how close it will track...just seems to me at this time that it will track far enough off the coast to where we don't see any real meaningful QPF that will generate widespread moderate totals...just a question of how much more moisture can get thrown back into the region...at least there is a decent slug of moisture that works northward though looking at the RH fields at H7. This is why I'd be sweating my fanny off calling for anything more than 5-6'' of snow. Kind of blows the BL will be so warm and we have to deal with ****ty ratios.

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How many times have you known the RGEM to be surpressed? It'd usually have a low over Albany at about this stage.

The 0z NAM came towards the 18z GFS in a very noticeable way through the first 18-24 after which as it always does it reverts to it's old biases. That could spell bad news here in 20-30 minutes.

I don't think we can wave our hands and say it's entirely feedback. There's going to be a s/w out there, jet etc. There's going to be a surface reflection. This isn't totally spurious. Maybe the degree it's developing it is, but to characterize every model as having feedback on the same feature at the same time would have to be a historic event.

GFS will tell us which way it's going, like you Jerry I'd put more faith in it than the RGEM, but let's acknowledge that since 18z every model has shifted within itself SE.

Are you expecting 6-12?, seems pretty obvious this is not going to blow up and rake us. A 3-6 dealio.

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Trough starts going neg off HAT but the ol' girl speeds E-NE? Lolz

If not much else changes we'd need the northern systerm to go negative/close for a time so the system could almost get pulled back. As it is the timing blows and we are seeing that ugly NW to SE orientation off the Carolinas. We don't want to see that on the 0z GFS...we want it back towars the more N/S extension of the lows one off/on the Carolinas one just off the GA/FL coast. If we see that more like southern coast of NC to northeast of the bahamas...doh.

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Are you expecting 6-12?, seems pretty obvious this is not going to blow up and rake us. A 3-6 dealio.

I was expecting 3-6, if the 0z NAM/RGEM are an indication of how the other models will play out (based on their earlier alignments) I'll be expecting not much other than wet disappoinment.

I don't believe we'd have that extension back like the NAM in that situation, I'm hoping the incoming models show pretty much what they did earlier and don't continue to nudge SE.

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I can't believe a news station in CT through at 5-10" amounts. Completely irresponsible and ridiculous...the only thing to support it would be the 12z nam. I guarantee at school tomorrow someone will ask me if we are getting 10" of snow Saturday. :arrowhead:

"threw out" - sorry, I'm a stickler for grammar.

That is crazy though! Link?

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How many times have you known the RGEM to be surpressed? It'd usually have a low over Albany at about this stage.

The 0z NAM came towards the 18z GFS in a very noticeable way through the first 18-24 after which as it always does it reverts to it's old biases. That could spell bad news here in 20-30 minutes.

I don't think we can wave our hands and say it's entirely feedback. There's going to be a s/w out there, jet etc. There's going to be a surface reflection. This isn't totally spurious. Maybe the degree it's developing it is, but to characterize every model as having feedback on the same feature at the same time would

have to be a historic eveGFS will tell us which way it's going, like you Jerry I'd put more faith in it than the RGEM, but let's acknowledge that since 18z every model has shifted within itself SE.

All The time Scott...all the time. It's not at all suppressed..ts plenty amped but too far east.

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I was expecting 3-6, if the 0z NAM/RGEM are an indication of how the other models will play out (based on their earlier alignments) I'll be expecting not much other than wet disappoinment.

I don't believe we'd have that extension back like the NAM in that situation, I'm hoping the incoming models show pretty much what they did earlier and don't continue to nudge SE.

Scott the RGEM gives you 3-6 and it's still snowing at the end of the run.

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Scott the RGEM gives you 3-6 and it's still snowing at the end of the run.

It's going to be warm in the BL Steve with a system that far out.

GFS looks to have gone away from the 18z, slowing down the southern s/w a tad and holding back the little 12 unit vort that was kicking up trouble. At 24 or so it looks to be aligned fairly well.

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Is it just me or when looking at the 500mb solution of the 0z NAM and you compare it to 12z EURO, they look similar with the southern branch shortwave being kicked farther out to see. After learning in class this week about phasing and how the models love to over-predict it, not going to bite on it.

Also I believe that the met who forecasted the 5-10 was going off the digging upper level trough, and that it will keep the low closer to the coast.

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Eh...what I don't like in terms of storm moisture is by 18/24 it's already amping up precip east of Florida and north of the bahamas. Lots of convection firing out there compared to the 18z and 12z at the same time.

I don't think it's possible to get models to ditch feedback with these dynamics and huge baroclinicity with the thermal gradient incoming. May be otl but jmho.

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Is it just me or when looking at the 500mb solution of the 0z NAM and you compare it to 12z EURO, they look similar with the southern branch shortwave being kicked farther out to see. After learning in class this week about phasing and how the models love to over-predict it, not going to bite on it.

Also I believe that the met who forecasted the 5-10 was going off the digging upper level trough, and that it will keep the low closer to the coast.

Hey Tyler! Glad you registered

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