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February storm threat discussion


Ellinwood

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euro pretty blah other than a northern stream vort dropping se to our west around feb 10. it looked sorta interesting for like half a second then not really. run not done.. out to 222 there's a whole lotta warmth to the west again.

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Once again, the "pattern change" is turning into a cold front passage that will drop our temps a couple degrees below normal for 2-3 days and then it's right back to pseudo-spring.

The -NAO that was advertised a few days ago has now been dropped by the progs. GFS still hangs onto the big +PNA ridge out west through the ensemble run, but the Euro looks like it's already decaying by Day 10. PV is not dropping into Hudson Bay in the long range anymore, as was previously forecast, but remains stuck near the Davis Straights were it has been all freaking winter.

Edit...forget "decaying". PNA ridge is completely GONE on the Day 10 prog on the Euro.

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looks like gulf of alaska low might be setting up shop again at the end of the run. coldest air in southern canada is near new england if that's any sort of good news. northern plains torch inching east into 240.

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Once again, the "pattern change" is turning into a cold front passage that will drop our temps a couple degrees below normal for 2-3 days and then it's right back to pseudo-spring.

The -NAO that was advertised a few days ago has now been dropped by the progs. GFS still hangs onto the big +PNA ridge out west through the ensemble run, but the Euro looks like it's already decaying by Day 10. PV is not dropping into Hudson Bay in the long range anymore, as was previously forecast, but remains stuck near the Davis Straights were it has been all freaking winter.

That it keeps a positive NAO is a bad sign. My 2 week cold period doesn't even look seasonal.

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I tried to tell you all this was gonna happen! La Nina February climo ftw

I'm-a waitin for my pattern flip LOLOLOL

Nothing is believable except the weather outside. I wonder if the programs that are the heart of the computer models are too precise, too complex. Are efforts to predict weather 10-20-30 days in advance causing models to be less accurate than they might be if they were run only to about 7 days. I don't know any of those answers, but something makes these things jump around like a rabbit. I would love to see our mets just take the initial conditions globally and write a general forecast for each day 1 through 7 and then compare that with what actually happens and then compare that with the model forecast for each individual day that was predicted 5 days earlier by the chosen model.

Anyway, just rambling thoughts since there's nothing else to do but gripe. I never have figured out why 99% of the planet needs weather forecasts 2 weeks in advance. Just to see if we can do it, I guess.

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Nothing is believable except the weather outside. I wonder if the programs that are the heart of the computer models are too precise, too complex. Are efforts to predict weather 10-20-30 days in advance causing models to be less accurate than they might be if they were run only to about 7 days.

No.

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maybe we can get things right by march ;)

Based on what happened following the three warmest December-January combinations in DC history, that may not be all that far-fetched. As I noted on this thread -- http://www.americanw...t-in-dc-history -- the three warmest combinations are December 1931-January 1932, December 1949-January 1950 (also a La Nina), and December 1889-January 1890. In February 1932 and February 1950, there was only a trace of snow; and in February 1890, there was just 1.5 inches. However, the March totals in those snow seasons were as follows, with the total snowfall for each season in parentheses:

March 1932: 4.0 inches (Total: 5.0 inches)

March 1950: 3.1 inches (Total: 3.4 inches)

March 1890: 5.0 inches (Total: 6.5 inches)

So, not exactly March blizzards, but at least something after next to nothing previously for the entire season.

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With the AO still below 4, I still see a chance at some snow. Everyone who was advising against taking some of the better model runs to the bank are now jumping ship because of a couple runs of the Euro. And the 5 day plus Euro for that matter! Which has clearly been atrocious. Its obviously frustrating, but the models are having serious problems with this pattern. This is coming from a historian, not a meteorologist, so take it at that.

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the problem with being neutral/open minded with respect to the upcoming weeks/month is

1) persistence

2) nina climo

3) we live in DC

so it isn't a blank canvas we are working with....the default positon is epic suck and we need overwhelming evidence and momentum to get that unstuck.....having snow climo and maybe MJO on our side for the next 2-3 weeks is one thing to help get it unstuck, so there is no reason to give up on a small frozen event or 2....but it is much more reasonable to buy into bad model solutions simply because those solutions are more probable....solutions that go against the default outside of 3-4 days don't mean a whole lot....

so my attitude now is not to worry about the models outside 96 hours...I am going to assume they will suck or if they are good that they are wrong....focus on 3-4 days ahead and take score in 6 weeks....maybe we get a March 99, or Feb 2006, or March 2009....maybe we get something minor...or maybe we get shut out....we will see

This goes into the more fun/anecdotal category, but I still like a huge east coast storm in March to bookend the filth that came in between.....problem for me is climo so it could be a 6" JYO event and .75" of slop for me

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the problem with being neutral/open minded with respect to the upcoming weeks/month is

1) persistence

2) nina climo

3) we live in DC

so it isn't a blank canvas we are working with....the default positon is epic suck and we need overwhelming evidence and momentum to get that unstuck.....having snow climo and maybe MJO on our side for the next 2-3 weeks is one thing to help get it unstuck, so there is no reason to give up on a small frozen event or 2....but it is much more reasonable to buy into bad model solutions simply because those solutions are more probable....solutions that go against the default outside of 3-4 days don't mean a whole lot....

so my attitude now is not to worry about the models outside 96 hours...I am going to assume they will suck or if they are good that they are wrong....focus on 3-4 days ahead and take score in 6 weeks....maybe we get a March 99, or Feb 2006, or March 2009....maybe we get something minor...or maybe we get shut out....we will see

This goes into the more fun/anecdotal category, but I still like a huge east coast storm in March to bookend the filth that came in between.....problem for me is climo so it could be a 6" JYO event and .75" of slop for me

Very reasonable approach IMHO

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zwtys wrote...

"1) persistence

2) nina climo

3) we live in DC

so it isn't a blank canvas we are working with....the default positon is epic suck and we need overwhelming evidence and momentum to get that unstuck.....having snow climo and maybe MJO on our side for the next 2-3 weeks is one thing to help get it unstuck, so there is no reason to give up on a small frozen event or 2....but it is much more reasonable to buy into bad model solutions simply because those solutions are more probable....solutions that go against the default outside of 3-4 days don't mean a whole lot...."

Well said...this should be everyones expectation.

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I am with WxUSAF on next winter Rockin. I went in detail about winter 2012-2013 and some people got angry, because this winter is not over with. Anyway my hopes are slim without the(-NAO) no big snows. 75% of winter is over in my book with the pattern. Hope we can squeeze something out soon.

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