Ginx snewx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 29 at home, 35 in Ledyard Ct work, no precip at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I studied this a lot my senior year of college at Cornell...and its kind of quirky...especially if you have some evap cooling potential and some upslope. It doesn't take a ton of weird helpers to get some crappy flakes if you have onshore flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I studied this a lot my senior year of college at Cornell...and its kind of quirky...especially if you have some evap cooling potential and some upslope. It doesn't take a ton of weird helpers to get some crappy flakes if you have onshore flow. The salt nuclei is an interesting topic. good stuff Will, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Snowing nicely here now... vis likely 1-2 miles. Look at the temperature difference up here this morning... this is why the eastern side of the mountain here retains snow so much better than the west. Its already low 30s a few miles away on the other side of the mountain, while this side is low 20s. That 4,000ft spine makes for a great divider. We shouldn't take much, if any, of a hit to the snowpack with this event... the fluff on top will just settle out and firm up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The salt nuclei is an interesting topic. good stuff Will, thanks I became really interested in it back in 2002 when I went on an interview to be the NWS BOX intern in summer of '02 in March of 2002 (probably a rare thing now days)....and Dave Vallee grilled me on why the Mar 20, 2002 storm might as end as rain at ORH from straight snow and I gave him the right answer at the time because I knew about snow growth (good thing I was even a weenie back then), but didn't really know it as well as I should. So I read like 4 papers on it including one from the local NWS BGM (at the time when I was back in Ithaca) and I came across the studies that showed the ice nucleation much more efficient on the shore line with warmer wetbulb temps. In the interior, it was more common to see FZDR with wetbulb temps around -6C than it was closer to the coast when dendrites were more efficient at warmer temps. It was shown that dendrites were almost completely absent once the wetbulb temp wamred about -4C even on the coast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I became really interested in it back in 2002 when I went on an interview to be the NWS BOX intern in summer of '02 in March of 2002 (probably a rare thing now days)....and Dave Vallee grilled me on why the Mar 20, 2002 storm might as end as rain at ORH from straight snow and I gave him the right answer at the time because I knew about snow growth (good thing I was even a weenie back then), but didn't really know it as well as I should. So I read like 4 papers on it including one from the local NWS BGM (at the time when I was back in Ithaca) and I came across the studies that showed the ice nucleation much more efficient on the shore line with warmer wetbulb temps. In the interior, it was more common to see FZDR with wetbulb temps around -6C than it was closer to the coast when dendrites were more efficient at warmer temps. It was shown that dendrites were almost completely absent once the wetbulb temp wamred about -4C even on the coast. I've seen it so often....It's big with OES too. I've probably come across some of those papers..it was actually after Drag mentioned it way back in the early 2000s that I actually cared enough to read. So many variables go into snow growth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dendrite Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The nam didn't even have anything near -4C TWs in the moist layer though over FWN at 9z. Maybe it underestimated the cloud tops and they're just high enough for a little nucleation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I've seen it so often....It's big with OES too. I've probably come across some of those papers..it was actually after Drag mentioned it way back in the early 2000s that I actually cared enough to read. So many variables go into snow growth. One of the papers I came across back then in 2002 (lol even in the age of internet) was a paper journal...I think it was BAMS or weather journal....it was the 1994 case study in south Weymouth MA where the temp profile supported sleet but OES promoted snow growth below the warm layer so they were getting synoptic sleet at the same time they were getting +SN from mesoscale processes....I think it was shown that the 725mb temps were +2-+3C while 900mb temps were -11C where the max mesoscale lift was occurring. So places as far north as ASH and MHT were sleeting and NZW (back when they still had obs in 1994) was heavy snow AND ice pellets at the same time. One of the weirdest case studies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The nam didn't even have anything near -4C TWs in the moist layer though over FWN at 9z. Maybe it underestimated the cloud tops and they're just high enough for a little nucleation. I think its been shown too that even like 70-80% RH above the saturated layer can produce seeder-feeder snow growth...so that has to be looked at too in addition to how accurate the model soundings are. You can get no saturated layer, but if its decently moist above the actual saturated layer, you can still get seeder feeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 One of the papers I came across back then in 2002 (lol even in the age of internet) was a paper journal...I think it was BAMS or weather journal....it was the 1994 case study in south Weymouth MA where the temp profile supported sleet but OES promoted snow growth below the warm layer so they were getting synoptic sleet at the same time they were getting +SN from mesoscale processes....I think it was shown that the 725mb temps were +2-+3C while 900mb temps were -11C where the max mesoscale lift was occurring. So places as far north as ASH and MHT were sleeting and NZW (back when they still had obs in 1994) was heavy snow AND ice pellets at the same time. One of the weirdest case studies. That's awesome. Talk about an inversion. Too bad they don't report anymore. That area is always on the line for many events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dendrite Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I think its been shown too that even like 70-80% RH above the saturated layer can produce seeder-feeder snow growth...so that has to be looked at too in addition to how accurate the model soundings are. You can get no saturated layer, but if its decently moist above the actual saturated layer, you can still get seeder feeder. Yeah. I don't have the soundings in front of me on my phone right now, but I think they were exceptionally dry above the moist layer throughout NJ. I'm not doubting the reports...I'm just saying I wouldn't have expected anything other than ZR/R from the soundings I looked at. Cool NZW case study though...I'll have to find that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mahk_webstah Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Yeah. I don't have the soundings in front of me on my phone right now, but I think they were exceptionally dry above the moist layer throughout NJ. I'm not doubting the reports...I'm just saying I wouldn't have expected anything other than ZR/R from the soundings I looked at. Cool NZW case study though...I'll have to find that one. are you getting the occassional bursts of weenie flakes? man we sure do hold onto cold air here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIPPYVALLEY Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 26F Freezing mist right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgwp96 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Must be just good enough for crappy snow grains or flakes. it was odd, soundings didnt look like it supported snow and some flakes that came down were decent size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 12Z Nam soundings indicate most spots only spend 24- 36 hours below freezing away from the coast. Low clouds and fog also, snow pack might just survive IMBY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgwp96 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Yeah. I don't have the soundings in front of me on my phone right now, but I think they were exceptionally dry above the moist layer throughout NJ. I'm not doubting the reports...I'm just saying I wouldn't have expected anything other than ZR/R from the soundings I looked at. Cool NZW case study though...I'll have to find that one. only started to saturate at 900 level, heres sort of what the sounding looked like. many areas of nj jersey saw light snow and flurries thorughtout the night. mine went to freezing drizzle at about 2 am Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisM Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 above freezing now, nonevent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Still getting occasional flakes... had about 1/4" this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Valleys are the coldest spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan11 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 35 and ovc. We had no precipitation here period... frozen or unfrozen. Valleys are the coldest spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Rain Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Valleys are the coldest spots. Mount Tolland FTL AWT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolland Death Band Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Mount Tolland FTL AWT You could do a piece tonight on snowpack destruction - show ragged looking kids sledding on patches of dirt, etc. We'd be a good spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 On air last nite Ryan had all of CT even the valleys above 32 by mid-late morning..That forecast FTL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Rain Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 On air last nite Ryan had all of CT even the valleys above 32 by mid-late morning..That forecast FTL Had east slope of hills and ct valley from hfd north above 32 by noon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Had east slope of hills and ct valley from hfd north above 32 by noon. FTL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJwinter23 Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Anybody in the CT River valley still dealing with icing issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ineedsnow Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 33/30 here had some light icing this morning but mostly just wet now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professional Lurker Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Anybody in the CT River valley still dealing with icing issues? Northfield Mt Hermon's station is reading 29.8* currently, but it's 3 miles away, and much lower in elevation. Honestly, not a ton of icing that I can see, steady light drizzle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIPPYVALLEY Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Anybody in the CT River valley still dealing with icing issues? I'm technically "in the Valley" but N and close to 400'. 29F still freezing drizzle here with lite glazing on most surfaces but not causing any real issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allenson Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Anybody in the CT River valley still dealing with icing issues? <32 with drizzle in the part of the CT River valley (Hanover, NH atm). No icing though except one section of brick sidewalk I strolled across on campus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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