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Southeast Mid/Long Range Discussion III


Rankin5150

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Wish I understood the continued optimism I keep reading -- still no Greenland blocking, PNA is terrible, SSW not materializing.

Looks like we get midway through February without a real shot. It's not over, but it's close and the odds are 8 or 9 out of 10 that we non-mountain types go snowless this winter, imo.

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Wish I understood the continued optimism I keep reading -- still no Greenland blocking, PNA is terrible, SSW not materializing.

Looks like we get midway through February without a real shot. It's not over, but it's close and the odds are 8 or 9 out of 10 that we non-mountain types go snowless this winter, imo.

Call me a glass half full guy. It's simply going to be about timing. I'll continue checking the models just to see if we can get cold and moisture in around the same time. While I personally agree the window is closing, I still think we've gotta get one shot at something. Hell the euro might continue with it's depiction last night and give us something to atleast hope for.

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Fair enough.

Call me a glass half full guy. It's simply going to be about timing. I'll continue checking the models just to see if we can get cold and moisture in around the same time. While I personally agree the window is closing, I still think we've gotta get one shot at something. Hell the euro might continue with it's depiction last night and give us something to atleast hope for.

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Call me a glass half full guy. It's simply going to be about timing. I'll continue checking the models just to see if we can get cold and moisture in around the same time. While I personally agree the window is closing, I still think we've gotta get one shot at something. Hell the euro might continue with it's depiction last night and give us something to atleast hope for.

Well as a varsity bball coach at a small school of a team that has won 2 games in the last 60 and yet still believes my guys will win each time we take the court......I too can be optimistic, so ditto!! Lol

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PRELIMINARY EXTENDED FORECAST DISCUSSION

NWS HYDROMETEOROLOGICAL PREDICTION CENTER CAMP SPRINGS MD

900 AM EST MON JAN 23 2012

VALID 12Z FRI JAN 27 2012 - 12Z MON JAN 30 2012

LARGE-SCALE MODEL AGREEMENT IS QUITE GOOD THIS CYCLE...WITH THE

MEDIUM RANGE PERIOD OVER NORTH AMERICA BEGINNING WITH A WEAK BLOCK

OVER NUNAVUT THAT FAVORS A SPLIT-FLOW REGIME OVER THE

CONUS...WHICH THE DETERMINISTIC SOLUTIONS RESOLVE.

HOWEVER...IMPORTANT SOLUTION DIFFERENCES EXIST WITH THE SPLIT

PATTERN...PARTICULARLY WITH A CLOSED LOW CROSSING TEXAS STARTING

DAY 3/THU. THE 00Z ECMWF HAS THE STRONGEST SUPPORT FROM THE

DETERMINISTIC CONSENSUS AND THE GLOBAL ENSEMBLE MEANS...WITH THE

PARALLEL GEFS MEAN NOT QUITE AS SLOW AS ITS OPERATIONAL

VERSION...WHILE THE 00Z GFS/UKMET ACCELERATE TOWARD THE FAST SIDE

OF THE GUIDANCE REACHING THE EAST COAST BY DAY 4/FRI. ALTHOUGH

MODELS HAVE TRENDED FASTER...CLOSED LOWS HAVE A TENDENCY TO MOVE

MORE SLOWLY THAN PROJECTED. THUS...PREFER TO EXCLUDE THE FASTER

GFS/UKMET FROM THE PREFERENCES...WHICH LEAVES THE ECMWF AS THE

PRIMARY CHOICE.

STARTING DAY 5/SAT...THE BLOCK OVER NUNAVUT IS EXPECTED ERODE AND

EVENTUALLY BECOME REPLACED BY A BROAD TROUGH EXTENDING SOUTHWARD

TOWARD THE PLAINS. DETERMINING THE PRECISE DETAILS OF THIS GRADUAL

PATTERN CHANGE...ALONG WITH GROWING UNCERTAINTIES DEVELOPING OVER

THE PACIFIC...

CONFIDENCE FALLS DRAMATICALLY FROM DAY 5 ONWARD. THUS...THE

PREFERENCE IS TOO MOVE QUICKLY TOWARD THE ECMWF ENSEMBLE MEAN

THEREAFTER. THE 00Z GEFS MEAN IS CLOSE IN PHASE AND THUS IS AN

ACCEPTABLE ALTERNATIVE DESPITE ITS SLIGHTLY LESS PREFERRED SPATIAL

RESOLUTION.

JAMES

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All eyes will def. be on the Euro this run to see what it does. I'll be here for the PBP.

I wouldn't expect much....not referring to your pbp, of course, as it is always the highest quality. But I expect the Euro will continue it's trend of no blocking, transient cool shots and intermittent ridging/troughing out west.

The core problem is, I believe -- as has been the case all winter long, as evidenced by this atypically wet La Nina -- is that the flow is super full of energy. That's is a big reason we're not getting huge amplification and stable PNA ridging and stable NAO blocking.

I fully expect to see something like "Euro LR, meh" by 2:00 today.

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I wouldn't expect much....not referring to your pbp, of course, as it is always the highest quality. But I expect the Euro will continue it's trend of no blocking, transient cool shots and intermittent ridging/troughing out west.

The core problem is, I believe -- as has been the case all winter long, as evidenced by this atypically wet La Nina -- is that the flow is super full of energy. That's is a big reason we're not getting huge amplification and stable PNA ridging and stable NAO blocking.

I fully expect to see something like "Euro LR, meh" by 2:00 today.

Good points. NAO has been and continues to look like a disaster. 12z GFS Ens is cooler than normal in the mid-extended range with fairly consistent ridging along the west coast and negative anomalies moving into the Aleutian Islands....but that would likely favor weakish storms/precip (clipper types) unless you had a closed ridge in W Canada with flow undercutting the ridge into the western states.

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Thanks for all the PBP Jonathan!! Your contributions do not go unnoticed!

Agreed! Very good pbp, and very appreciatted!

I wouldn't expect much....not referring to your pbp, of course, as it is always the highest quality. But I expect the Euro will continue it's trend of no blocking, transient cool shots and intermittent ridging/troughing out west.

The core problem is, I believe -- as has been the case all winter long, as evidenced by this atypically wet La Nina -- is that the flow is super full of energy. That's is a big reason we're not getting huge amplification and stable PNA ridging and stable NAO blocking.

I fully expect to see something like "Euro LR, meh" by 2:00 today.

Thanks guys! So far out to 126 there are a few differences from last nights run but we'll see where it goes.

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@174 cold air is retreating while a low in the GOM starts to get going .

Not enough cold air around I'm afraid. All the cold in the northern Hemisphere is squarely located in Alaska and Siberia. Canada is actually very lacking in any significant cold pool. There is a small pool of cold south of the Hudson bay but it's small, localized and the rest of Canada looks relatively warm.

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Not enough cold air around I'm afraid. All the cold in the northern Hemisphere is squarely located in Alaska and Siberia. Canada is actually very lacking in any significant cold pool. There is a small pool of cold south of the Hudson bay but it's small, localized and the rest of Canada looks relatively warm.

Yea some cool air is sticking around @180 but not nearly enough. The timing just isn't right. Looks like WAA is going to scour out the cold.

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Could this 168 thing be something to watch on euro? Is there a chance cold air stays?

Keep watch on, yes. But i wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Keep in mind that the models were likely 15 degrees or so too warm earlier last week for the temps this week. Also, in Greensboro we got just below freezing yesterday morning when no models the middle of last week showed any such cold air. As long as there is cold air in Canada and big highs slide across, don't underestimate CAD. I think we'll need some blocking for a good snow threat though.

TW

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A deluge for central NC on the Euro, 3" of rain, in 24 hours.

FRI 06Z 27-JAN 13.9 10.0 1011 98 100 0.19 568 559

FRI 12Z 27-JAN 13.6 9.9 1010 98 100 0.55 567 559

FRI 18Z 27-JAN 14.2 9.6 1010 99 98 0.60 566 558

SAT 00Z 28-JAN 11.2 8.4 1008 98 92 0.60 562 555

SAT 06Z 28-JAN 7.1 6.7 1007 98 95 1.01 557 551

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