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12Z Model Thread


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Yeah, I was interested in how the ensembles look...not bad from being so far out. The op runs will struggle on the outcome, but always a good sign of the ensemble mean has it, especially if it goes west of the previous run from 12hrs ago.

It looks like it's close to 00z or perhaps just a hair east, but looks better than the op.

Edit: it is actually west a bit early on. My fault. arrowheadsmiley.png

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kind of an amateur, but why does the gefs show the storm while the gfs didnt show it for sunday? whats your take on the gefs showing the storm?

The gefs is a compilation or an average if you will of ten (I think?) model solutions put together. Apparently several of the solutions are still showing an east coast storm and that will reflect in the gefs. Whereas the GFS operational is just one model solution, and this time it did not show the storm.

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kind of an amateur, but why does the gefs show the storm while the gfs didnt show it for sunday? whats your take on the gefs showing the storm?

An ensemble system takes a "control" model run and perturbs the initial conditions of the numerical model to consider the effects of errors in the data assimilation system. Think chaos theory...tiny initial condition errors can result in massive forecast errors with time. The GFS ensemble has I believe 11 perturbed members and 1 control run, and you can take these different solutions and develop a "mean" as well as look at each individual member. So, for instance, if 2-3 members show a large storm and 7-8 don't, the mean will reflect those members showing the storm. In this case I find the individual members more informational than the mean. Height field maps and vorticity maps will help a lot in this case too.

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Are you surprised the precip. isn't more west given the low position? Anyway, maybe it's better at this point they show a storm but a little south or east.

I'm not...it's pretty far off the coast. This isn't last winter when we had an El Nino...phasing is harder to come by in La Ninas, so I wouldn't say it's better that the models are a miss right now, because that very well could be the outcome. I definitley wouldn't get too excited yet, as there's a lot that has to happen. Wes went with a 25/75 happening/not happening ratio- I'd agree with that for now.

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I'm not...it's pretty far off the coast. This isn't last winter when we had an El Nino...phasing is harder to come by in La Ninas, so I wouldn't say it's better that the models are a miss right now, because that very well could be the outcome. I definitley wouldn't get too excited yet, as there's a lot that has to happen. Wes went with a 25/75 happening/not happening ratio- I'd agree with that for now.

The low in the one panel isn't that far east. Also, in a Nina, things tend to head north. All the models are still showing the potential, so that's the important thing.

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I'm not...it's pretty far off the coast. This isn't last winter when we had an El Nino...phasing is harder to come by in La Ninas, so I wouldn't say it's better that the models are a miss right now, because that very well could be the outcome. I definitley wouldn't get too excited yet, as there's a lot that has to happen. Wes went with a 25/75 happening/not happening ratio- I'd agree with that for now.

the GGEM is a miss in terms of low placement and late phasing not NO phasing...I think thats important because at least the GGEM shows that....

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thanks this looks like a 1-2 inch event to me around dc ? What do you think?

GGEM always looks warm thickness wise on models. That being said.. overall the GGEM is much weaker with this system than it was previous run. A general 1 to 2 inches would "as depicted" on the GGEM for areas of Central va into lower Maryland on it. Mix precip south of that.

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The low in the one panel isn't that far east. Also, in a Nina, things tend to head north. All the models are still showing the potential, so that's the important thing.

I think the CMC positioning is pretty much inline with the other guidance which shows a rather compact PV anomaly ejecting NE along the Gulf. Considering how far that low is off the coast and the small size of this thing, doesn't seem weird to me. This definitely won't be a more typical noreaster event associated with a large trough/arctic air intrusion and a 180+ kt jet going negative off the coast.

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I think the CMC positioning is pretty much inline with the other guidance which shows a rather compact PV anomaly ejecting NE along the Gulf. Considering how far that low is off the coast and the small size of this thing, doesn't seem weird to me. This definitely won't be a more typical noreaster event associated with a large trough/arctic air intrusion and a 180+ kt jet going negative off the coast.

Ok, it's hard to see the size of the thing. But the storm is still on every model in a way, which is good.

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Guest someguy

Nice hit for the NJ coast, fringes of NYC, LI...and SNE. Lets not forget Eastern VA and MD too.

what is Most interesting is that the cmc is usually most progressive with coasdal systems

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