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Dec 24-28 winter weather period


Ji

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What drives me insane is that lately the conversations are like this:

Person 1: SNOW!

Person 2: RAIN!

Ian: It's gonna rain

Mattie g: i'm going to South Carolina

Ji: JB cancelled winter

Person 1: But the Euro map shows snow

Person X: Doesn't matter, it'll turn north

Mattie G: I like it warm.

Rinse. Repeat. Ad nauseam.

Then you probably should take a break or get some Prozac.

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I guess the question if the euro were 100% right is whether the surface temps would be cold enough to accumulate. At 12Z it looks like there is only a very small area of below freezing temps back in WV. The model has a warm bias but that's been the look this year. Yes there is a transient high but it slips off the coast. I for one don't trust the euro snow maps, I think they are pretty bad based on the two events that I've looked at this year. I don't see this set up as a dc accumulating snow set up but then I could always be wrong.

if i had to forecast just based on the crude maps of the euro and the run was day 1-2, I would call for up to an inch of snow/sleet in the cities for 2-4 hours at 33-35 degrees and then to rain....I think that would accumulate on the grass/decks/cars if we got a decent rate given it is overnight and the sun isnt a factor anyway...DCA might get a 0.3"...I think that is probably the type of event we are looking at if it even happens

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if i had to forecast just based on the crude maps of the euro and the run was day 1-2, I would call for up to an inch of snow/sleet in the cities for 2-4 hours at 33-35 degrees and then to rain....I think that would accumulate on the grass/decks/cars if we got a decent rate given it is overnight and the sun isnt a factor anyway...DCA might get a 0.3"...I think that is probably the type of event we are looking at if it even happens

This is a crappy pattern in so many ways. The lack of blocking makes timing various features tougher than normal as shortwaves just zip along in the flow. That's why when you look at the GEFS ensemble members they are in much more disarray than is typical for that time range.

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I wasn't mad because you said it was going to rain. And, you're right, people shouldn't attack you because you say it's going to rain.

But, you should have to defend yourself when you say it's going to rain. Like it or not, your reputation is at play. You (usually) provide sensible analysis and write for CWG, so, yeh, I do expect a bit more from you than "it's gonna rain"... not every time, but > 50%.

What drives me insane is that lately the conversations are like this:

Rinse. Repeat. Ad nauseam.

fair enough tho i think i've said why i think it will rain if you read the posts. perhaps not all in one post--so i should work on condensing my thoughts. sometimes it's just lack of time at any given moment. i tend to be a hit and run poster. but i did say that it's day 5 and i think the model will trend warmer if it trends and that the high exiting the coast already as modeled precip is arriving is not great. but most importantly it's day 5 and we go warm from there 9 out of 10 times. sure that's sort of a simplistic method in itself but it'll still work more often than not--plus the other factors of course, not to be dismissed is the seasonal trend.

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hard to believe all this discussion about specifics based on one model run on Tuesday. All we need to know right now is that there may be a storm for Christmas and its interesting enough to track....there is going to be daily fluctuation in where the 850 0 line in...the exact placement of high pressure when the storm comes,etc...

We still havent seen the same solution in multiple runs...when we start seeing the model lock into a solution on a more consistent basis..then we can cry about the specifics and declare the storm a bust.

Ian...its not hard to be wrong when predicting no snow in DC...my dad is right 9 out of 10 times and he dosent even follow weather

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hard to believe all this discussion about specifics based on one model run on Tuesday. All we need to know right now is that there may be a storm for Christmas and its interesting enough to track....there is going to be daily fluctuation in where the 850 0 line in...the exact placement of high pressure when the storm comes,etc...

We still havent seen the same solution in multiple runs...when we start seeing the model lock into a solution on a more consistent basis..then we can cry about the specifics and declare the storm a bust.

Ian...its not hard to be wrong when predicting no snow in DC...my dad is right 9 out of 10 times and he dosent even follow weather

finally the voice of reason

:bag:

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there is probably one member thats extremely warm and its skewing the mean. Toss it out

better hope so. at 120 the op has the 850 line in c va and the ens mean has it in s pa. tho i think it's been running faster than the op a bit.

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better hope so. at 120 the op has the 850 line in c va and the ens mean has it in s pa. tho i think it's been running faster than the op a bit.

i'd say it's around 6 hrs faster than the op but still has the 0c 850 north of dc ('bout balt to northern loudoun) compared to c va on the op when factorign that in .

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Maybe I'm just not smart enough to figure this out, but it seems that we view storms on the models with skepticism, but we view 10 day (and longer) forecasts that tell us it is going to get warm as likely. Oh well.

Probably because it usually works out that we will almost always get the warm, but not the storm.

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Maybe I'm just not smart enough to figure this out, but it seems that we view storms on the models with skepticism, but we view 10 day (and longer) forecasts that tell us it is going to get warm as likely. Oh well.

Your own phrasing pretty much answers your own question- it's not about cold vs. warm. It's about figuring out individual storms within a pattern vs. figuring out a general pattern itself. Of course, the pattern is going to be much easier to forecast...

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84 hr 18z NAM (yeah, I know) looks EUROish... 850 0c line is in C VA with the -3c line from BWI to Leesburg and then to the SE of Charleston WV in a NE to SW fashion... the 0c 2m line is west of the Apps... 1033 H is north/northeast of NY state in Canada but is moving east.

There is a s/w in NW MI and another one, albeit closed, in the TX panhandle. This is way different (well duh, of course it is Yoda!) than the 12z 78 hr h5 chart when you compare the 2

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