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November warmup 11/5 - 11/10


SACRUS

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The models suddenly went east almost as fast as they came west... ECM shows very light precip near the coast, the NAM still has less than 0.1" QPF west of NYC, GFS trended to less than 1/4", short range RUC/HRRR/RR models also show little QPF, and the CMC still has little precip. What the models are saying isn't the most important and by this time range, current observations become important as well, and I'm not ruling out a slightly wetter storm, but perhaps the heavier QPF over NYC on yesterday's 18z GFS may have been just a tease.

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12Z gfs shows 850s falling below zero between 15-18Z. Precip is still around by that time, and we could see some flakes mix in. If it falls hard enough could change to mostly snow for a period of time. No accumulation though as surface temps are way too warm.

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12Z gfs shows 850s falling below zero between 15-18Z. Precip is still around by that time, and we could see some flakes mix in. If it falls hard enough could change to mostly snow for a period of time. No accumulation though as surface temps are way too warm.

This Afternoon: A chance of rain and snow. Cloudy, with a steady temperature around 42. North wind around 14 mph. Chance of precipitation is 40%.<br style="font-family: Arial, Helvetica, 'San Serif'; text-align: -webkit-left; "><br style="font-family: Arial, Helvetica, 'San Serif'; text-align: -webkit-left; ">Tonight: A slight chance of rain and snow before 9pm. Cloudy during the early evening, then gradual clearing, with a low around 33. West wind between 13 and 16 mph. Chance of precipitation is 20%.

Chance of snow? is trials at the NOAA desk today?

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Usually on our coldest nights there is a pretty substantial spread from the interior to the cities. Last night there was only about a 6 degree difference from Sussex county to NYC. Even EWR was only about 4 degrees warmer than well N&W.

Got down to 33. Is the airmass just not cold enough or did the wind kill our chances of going lower?

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the low of 36 is the lowest so far this month...36 is the record highest monthly minimum for November set in 1998...it was 33 in October...The only other times November had a warmer minimum than October were 1975 and 1988...three horible snow analogs...

I said it before when people were hyping the warm November being good, its good sometimes but you really have to look closely at a number of things that seperate those warm Novembers that eventually turned snowy and those which did not. The storm frequency is also important, the fact we may get a couple of events here the next 10 days is a good sign, again dry and warm IMO is always worse than wet and warm, although JB and some other mets feel that wet and warm Novembers are a bad sign, I've never really agreed with that theory. I still think this is not going to be a great winter for most of the lower 48 in regards to cold and snow, it may not be 1998-99 or 2001-2002 esque but it could be like a 1984-85 or 1990-1991 (likely cooler than 1990-91 but the snow situation may be similar).

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As others have mentioned, a dry November is often more of a sign than a warm one. Some places have yet to see 1" for the month with next week's rain chance and one more shot to close out the month. But it's possible many locations end up with less than half of their normal amount.

I said it before when people were hyping the warm November being good, its good sometimes but you really have to look closely at a number of things that seperate those warm Novembers that eventually turned snowy and those which did not. The storm frequency is also important, the fact we may get a couple of events here the next 10 days is a good sign, again dry and warm IMO is always worse than wet and warm, although JB and some other mets feel that wet and warm Novembers are a bad sign, I've never really agreed with that theory. I still think this is not going to be a great winter for most of the lower 48 in regards to cold and snow, it may not be 1998-99 or 2001-2002 esque but it could be like a 1984-85 or 1990-1991 (likely cooler than 1990-91 but the snow situation may be similar).

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the low of 36 is the lowest so far this month...36 is the record highest monthly minimum for November set in 1998...it was 33 in October...The only other times November had a warmer minimum than October were 1975 and 1988...three horible snow analogs...

That just sent a sharp chill down my spine. Were 1975 and 1988 La Nina years and did those years feature snow in October?

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DT brings up a good point about Northern Hemisphere sunow cover being extensitve today and on the other side of the globe, record setting..wonder how that will play into things...

If we get rid of the GOA low it will be a big factor, even if we have a +AO/NAO all winter if we lose that GOA we can get plenty of decent transitorycold shots and have a shot at winter storms, if we don't lose that vortex though the cold air will never really make it into Canada or the lower 48.

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That just sent a sharp chill down my spine. Were 1975 and 1988 La Nina years and did those years feature snow in October?

1988-89 had La Nina comparable to last year, the difference is the AO was absolutely off the charts positive in the 88-89 winter, it averaged around 3.5 for Jan/Feb, somehow though February was one of the coolest on record for the central U.S., my gues is the EPO must have been very negative.. 1975-76 also was a La Nina similar to last years in strength, it also had a very positive AO and NAO overall.

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I said it before when people were hyping the warm November being good, its good sometimes but you really have to look closely at a number of things that seperate those warm Novembers that eventually turned snowy and those which did not. The storm frequency is also important, the fact we may get a couple of events here the next 10 days is a good sign, again dry and warm IMO is always worse than wet and warm, although JB and some other mets feel that wet and warm Novembers are a bad sign, I've never really agreed with that theory. I still think this is not going to be a great winter for most of the lower 48 in regards to cold and snow, it may not be 1998-99 or 2001-2002 esque but it could be like a 1984-85 or 1990-1991 (likely cooler than 1990-91 but the snow situation may be similar).

I went over the wettest and driest Novembers since 1950 and and came up with this list...red years are El Nino winters and blue La Nina...Black is nuetral...So far we are warm and dry...These years had 4.93" of rainfall or more for wet...2.55" or less for dry...48.0 degrees or above for warm and below 48.0 for cool...1964 had an exceptable winter after the warm and dry November.....

Wet/Warm...Wet/Cool...Dry/Warm...Dry/Cool...

1963.............1951...........1953...........1958

1970.............1954...........1964...........1965

1983.............1968...........1973...........1967

1985.............1971...........1974...........1976

1988.............1972...........1993...........1981

2006.............1977...........1998...........1991

....................1986...........1999...........2010

....................1992...........2001

....................1995...........2009

....................2002

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