scoob40 Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I think the Peru site is at 1900'....I know the town center is at 2000' and I believe it's the highest town center center in New England. I know what you mean about being properly sited....there's so many problems with that all over. Then people just use the one that that suits them...warm or cold bias. Cold bias ? MRG ? ...... A total impossibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 Cold bias ? MRG ? ...... A total impossibility. It can go either way....and I'm not singling anyone out. You have some sensors in the middle of an evergreen forest that never see the light of day that run cool, then you have the sensors up on the roof that really 'shine' on clear sunny days and spike up. I have a half dozen thermometers in different places and I can see all kinds of readings but I consider my official readings taken in a clearing inside a cotton shelter. I could probably choose any one within a 5-10 degree range if I wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 We all do the best we can. Not everyone can site an insulated aspirated station on the Tarmac Whose to say which stations are off by how much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 We all do the best we can. Not everyone can site an insulated aspirated station on the Tarmac Whose to say which stations are off by how much. Gosh, my apologies if my comment came across that way....I agree that everyone does the best that they can and there is no way to determine how far a station is off but you can certainly see standouts in the middle of a sunny day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Gosh, my apologies if my comment came across that way....I agree that everyone does the best that they can and there is no way to determine how far a station is off but you can certainly see standouts in the middle of a sunny day. BDL in an aspirated shelter is still in the middle of an asphalt jungle, just off the Tarmac it's 5 degrees cooler, people live not in airports. Always though siting ASOS in CITY airports was part of our climate change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 Gosh, my apologies if my comment came across that way....I agree that everyone does the best that they can and there is no way to determine how far a station is off but you can certainly see standouts in the middle of a sunny day. No apology needed. What you said was spot on. My poorly worded response was meant as support of your statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 How could a low reading be gained by poor siting? Too many trees? I could see if it was too high... Oh you can definitely be up to 10F too cold if you have too many trees around... stick a thermometer in a forest during growing season when there is a thick leaf cover overhead and you'll run very cold during the day... the flip side is you'll likely run a bit warm at night. I have that problem at my parent's lakehouse in Woodstock, CT... there's really no way around it without clearing trees as the house is in a fairly dense forest with not many openings for sunlight. At that location I run like 5F lower than the ASOS at ORH during max daytime heating and the elevation there is like 790ft or so... if anything it should be 1-2F warmer than ORH there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 We all do the best we can. Not everyone can site an insulated aspirated station on the Tarmac Whose to say which stations are off by how much. Oh certainly... not meaning to say it is done on purpose, not at all. You work with what you are given with but you can certainly tell the difference on sunny days when certain stations are showing like a 10F/1000ft adiabatic rate from other known, regulated stations. On cloudy days it doesn't really matter... also won't matter in the winter once the leaves fall off the trees. The forest will always be cooler than out in the middle of a field on a sunny day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Oh certainly... not meaning to say it is done on purpose, not at all. You work with what you are given with but you can certainly tell the difference on sunny days when certain stations are showing like a 10F/1000ft adiabatic rate from other known, regulated stations. On cloudy days it doesn't really matter... also won't matter in the winter once the leaves fall off the trees. The forest will always be cooler than out in the middle of a field on a sunny day. Which makes me glad I live surrounded by trees and not by buildings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I would die quickly , check out the F 6 for August http://www.weather.gov/climate/index.php?wfo=hgx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Which makes me glad I live surrounded by trees and not by buildings. Haha yeah... but you probably don't radiate well at night compared with the farmer down the road that has a few trees scattered about with 80% field around him. And I mean who's to say "what is right?" The temperature in the woods or the temperature out in the open? As MetHerb said, you can have a 5-10F variance across your property depending on where your therm is set-up. Its the same thing with measuring snowfall in the winter... measure it after the snow stops or every 6 hours? Of course NOAA needs to come up with some standards for all this, and it is what it is. Its like an 18 hour snowstorm where you take three measurements and get 4", 7", 4" for a total of 15". Your neighbor drops his ruler in the snow when it stops and comes up with 13.2". How much snow actually fell? Just what exactly is the temperature outside? In the woods or in the field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski MRG Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 If you enjoy above normal temps and high humidity..then yes it certainly is 67/63, a high of 73, back here in reality it was another below normal high, beautiful weather this evening for 18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski MRG Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I've had a stellar summer forecasting and it's nice to be recognized That's really funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 How much snow actually fell? Just what exactly is the temperature outside? In the woods or in the field? Interesting questions and very valid. The snow question gets me because I think it should be reflective of what fell at the end of the storm, but there is value in the every 6 hour measurement as well. In terms of temperature, I try to get a mix of sun and shade because it's reflective of what itfeels like around my house. Even properly sited the temperature can very up and down a hill...which begs another question - just what is the temperature in my town? Is it my temp or up at 1,200' or down at 450'? Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 67/63, a high of 73, back here in reality it was another below normal high, beautiful weather this evening for 18. lol... that is one amazing climate. I honestly have no horse in this race but I can't believe every other place in New England and NY had an above normal high temp today except for you For example ORH was +4F and BOS was +8F on the high... up here we were +4F at MVL, BTV was +5F, and MPV (1,200ft) was +4F. Mansfield summit was +5F. Peru at 1,900ft...75F Becket at 1,400ft...78F Huntington at 930ft...81F That's a textbook adiabatic rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 lol... that is one amazing climate. I honestly have no horse in this race but I can't believe every other place in New England and NY had an above normal high temp today except for you For example ORH was +4F and BOS was +8F on the high... up here we were +4F at MVL, BTV was +5F, and MPV (1,200ft) was +4F. Mansfield summit was +5F. Peru at 1,900ft...75F Becket at 1,400ft...78F Huntington at 930ft...81F We had a high of 79F... which was probably like +2 or +3... but I don't know what the actual avg is... probably close to ORH minus a degree or 2... just guessing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 We had a high of 79F... which was probably like +2 or +3... but I don't know what the actual avg is... probably close to ORH minus a degree or 2... just guessing Yeah that would make sense with ORH's average high being 77F. You'd probably be 75-76F for a +3F to +4F departure on the high temp... consistent with pretty much every climate station except BOS which really torched with +8F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski MRG Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 lol... that is one amazing climate. I honestly have no horse in this race but I can't believe every other place in New England and NY had an above normal high temp today except for you For example ORH was +4F and BOS was +8F on the high... up here we were +4F at MVL, BTV was +5F, and MPV (1,200ft) was +4F. Mansfield summit was +5F. Peru at 1,900ft...75F Becket at 1,400ft...78F Huntington at 930ft...81F That's a textbook adiabatic rate. Well, I wasn't the only one. Chester Hill was 72. I think today it was about lingering cloudiness. Never had good sun today. The Becket number seems right as I work at 2k there and it was about 74 and sunny up top. It is what it is. I know you've followed it for a while. It just runs cool here on the east slope. Nobody has to accept my numbers. There are other nearby stations that illustrate the cool very well. We seem to have lost the Ashfield site. I was always about the same for lows with Steve. Not sure what's going on with his site. Chester Hill is close on day time highs but Shaw Pond now is closest on lows, they're usually a degree or 2 warmer overnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski MRG Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 65/64, another good sleeping weather night. Haven't had a night we've had to use the fan since July. August will be over in the blink of an eye. The descent has already begun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan11 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Low of 56 and high of 77. Down to 63 now and quite comfortable if a tad humid. KALB was still 73 at 11 PM. I'm sure they think it's a muggy warmish night there. 67/63, a high of 73, back here in reality it was another below normal high, beautiful weather this evening for 18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dendrite Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Late run torch fail on last night's Euro. Instead we keep the troughiness much like the 12z ens had yesterday. Nice day 10 cat 5 striking Hatteras too...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Late run torch fail on last night's Euro. Instead we keep the troughiness much like the 12z ens had yesterday. Nice day 10 cat 5 striking Hatteras too...lol Models are stronger with the Midwest trough, but it probably means bigger blue balls for SNE..lol. EC ensembles still in the Gulf, but that could be possible due to members keeping the storm weak and moving it along with the mean low level easterlies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski MRG Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 58/58, cool with fall like fog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moneypitmike Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 lol... that is one amazing climate. I honestly have no horse in this race but I can't believe every other place in New England and NY had an above normal high temp today except for you For example ORH was +4F and BOS was +8F on the high... up here we were +4F at MVL, BTV was +5F, and MPV (1,200ft) was +4F. Mansfield summit was +5F. Peru at 1,900ft...75F Becket at 1,400ft...78F Huntington at 930ft...81F That's a textbook adiabatic rate. Shelburne at 1000'....77.8 62.0/61 attm with a lot of fog. Suspect it will burn off quickly though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I just noticed Phil has a met tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Torchey Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 73/66 swamp ass city this morning, text book August weather, no signs of fall, love how okx keeps raising temps everyday Not a drop of rain last night I see Boston was a +8 and Scooter got to 88, summer in full swing. Another day of solid +departures across the board, and with nighttime lows now held up with the higher humidity August is easily in the + (good) side. Very warm all over new england yesterday as powderkeg pointed out, except for one town on the east slope in the small hills of massachusetts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Models are stronger with the Midwest trough, but it probably means bigger blue balls for SNE..lol. EC ensembles still in the Gulf, but that could be possible due to members keeping the storm weak and moving it along with the mean low level easterlies. AKTY..AS Kevin thought yesterday..This thing may actually want to make a run up at us next weekend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineJayhawk Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Did you guys know that Pickles moved to Florida? Miser went down to see his old friend. Hope you do well in FLA, Pickles. It was a pleasure meeting you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Oh you can definitely be up to 10F too cold if you have too many trees around... stick a thermometer in a forest during growing season when there is a thick leaf cover overhead and you'll run very cold during the day... the flip side is you'll likely run a bit warm at night. I have that problem at my parent's lakehouse in Woodstock, CT... there's really no way around it without clearing trees as the house is in a fairly dense forest with not many openings for sunlight. At that location I run like 5F lower than the ASOS at ORH during max daytime heating and the elevation there is like 790ft or so... if anything it should be 1-2F warmer than ORH there. You just described where i live to a T. The forest determines the temps. It's a perfect example of the definition of a microclimate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I just noticed Phil has a met tag. But he doesn't post anymore . He got upset with someone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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