SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Might be time to begin calculating how many cogen plants we need to build during the next 20 years. Time to buy into NG and coal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clinch Leatherwood Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Slow motion trainwreck. I can't believe it's not leaking more radiation than it has but I suppose this is bad enough. Where all the radioactive water and steam is coming from is the ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkman Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 My guess is that Japan is giving all the information they have to other governments, that's why they've gone quiet with asking for info, but at the same time started taking precautions much more drastic that Japan seems willing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtRosen Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 http://www.katu.com/.../118648229.html Core breach at Japan nuclear plant is 'very grave' TOKYO (AP) - A suspected breach in the core of a reactor at the stricken Fukushima nuclear plant could mean more serious radioactive contamination, Japanese officials revealed Friday, as the prime minister called the country's ongoing fight to stabilize the plant "very grave and serious." A somber Prime Minister Naoto Kan sounded a pessimistic note at a briefing hours after nuclear safety officials announced what could be a major setback in the urgent mission to stop the plant from leaking radiation, two weeks after a devastating earthquake and tsunami disabled it. "The situation today at the Fukushima Dai-ichi power plant is still very grave and serious. We must remain vigilant," Kan said. "We are not in a position where we can be optimistic. We must treat every development with the utmost care." Does anyone else think we're over-reacting now? People in Tokyo can't drink their tap water, there is a nuclear core breach in at least one reactor and who knows what else they're not telling us? The Prime Minister of Japan himself is calling this situation "very grave." It isn't an over reaction when people's lives are in danger. Yes, the earthquake and tsunami probably killed 30,000 people or more, but the earthquake is over and there are no more tsunamis... that disaster can be fixed in the short term. The long term is that there has been a breach in the core of a nuclear reactor and there is radiation spewing out and god knows what levels. This is why I've been following this story so closely, because the government of Japan and their reports and what they're saying, is completely different from what's actually happening and we're finally getting to the bottom of the truth here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunny and Warm Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 http://www.katu.com/.../118648229.html Core breach at Japan nuclear plant is 'very grave' TOKYO (AP) - A suspected breach in the core of a reactor at the stricken Fukushima nuclear plant could mean more serious radioactive contamination, Japanese officials revealed Friday, as the prime minister called the country's ongoing fight to stabilize the plant "very grave and serious." A somber Prime Minister Naoto Kan sounded a pessimistic note at a briefing hours after nuclear safety officials announced what could be a major setback in the urgent mission to stop the plant from leaking radiation, two weeks after a devastating earthquake and tsunami disabled it. "The situation today at the Fukushima Dai-ichi power plant is still very grave and serious. We must remain vigilant," Kan said. "We are not in a position where we can be optimistic. We must treat every development with the utmost care." For a politician, that's tantamount to admitting all is lost. That level of pessimism is striking. If there is a core breach, what really can be done? The pure water solution failed today to bring any measurable balance to the reactor. With a leak, they will never be able to stabilize the core temp, while all the while radiation leaks into the ground water table. What to do in this sad situation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott747 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Kyodo - NEWS ADVISORY: Water radiation level near No.1 reactor 10,000 times normal level:TEPCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Kyodo - NEWS ADVISORY: Water radiation level near No.1 reactor 10,000 times normal level:TEPCO as I stated previously core breaches as well pool integrity has been stated as a concern for multiple reactors......in this page of the thread you see unit 3 and 1 mentioned. Recall unit 4 pool has been a concern for water loss via crack or damage. Where were those site overviews coming from earlier in the week? They provided unit by unit info and status? edit: recent update also states unit 2 has leaks......so that makes it unit 1, 2 and 3 with possible vessel leaks. one more edit: Water pools 40-150 cm deep found near all 4 troubled reactors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott747 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 as I stated previously core breaches as well pool integrity has been stated as a concern for multiple reactors......in this page of the thread you see unit 3 and 1 mentioned. Recall unit 4 pool has been a concern for water loss via crack or damage. Where were those site overviews coming from earlier in the week? They provided unit by unit info and status? edit: recent update also states unit 2 has leaks......so that makes it unit 1, 2 and 3 with possible vessel leaks. one more edit: Water pools 40-150 cm deep found near all 4 troubled reactors Suspected core breaches have been talked about as a possibility at all three reactors since the crisis started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunny and Warm Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 one more edit: Water pools 40-150 cm deep found near all 4 troubled reactors What does your comment above mean? What is the impact? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What does your comment above mean? What is the impact? The water which caused the trouble for the workers...... also check out this video and notice on several zoom shots the flakes flying around the areas where steam is venting.......in one possibly from a storage pool..... anyone have an idea what would cause that.....break down of the casings?? Wonder what the radiation levels of that material is and what its impact is in terms of escaping into the air? here is the link http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/25_30.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Suspected core breaches have been talked about as a possibility at all three reactors since the crisis started. the one hope regarding the core vessel breaches is pressure monitoring. If they are able to close venting and hold pressures....that would help indicate if there is a leak. I did see it mentioned in one article that one of the reactors was holding pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozart Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 I hear what you are saying but there also comes a point where you look at the bullet list of "thing we can do" and the options all suck. That's the Achille's heel unique to nuclear power -- the "no good solution" predicament that nuclear proponents assured us for 50 years we'd never have to face. And we still can't begin to know how bad the suckage is going to get. It all makes for quite the long-running public-service announcement about nuclear power, doesn't it? I agree with Sunny and Warm: the opacity out of Japan is becoming increasingly hard to defend. Everything is such a big mystery. Up until now we Americans have been content to treat the situation as if we were watching a volcano on Mars -- a spectacle that didn't affect us. But there comes a point when having to make educated guesses about basic, measurable indices like radiation levels will no longer be acceptable -- not to Americans, not to the Japanese people, not to anyone anywhere. I wonder when that point will be reached. I don't mean that knowing how bad things really are will open us to more solutions. It won't. This is, after all, a nuclear disaster. "No good solution" is the natural end game unique to nuclear snafus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 also check out this video and notice on several zoom shots the flakes flying around the areas where steam is venting.......in one possibly from a storage pool..... anyone have an idea what would cause that.....break down of the casings?? Wonder what the radiation levels of that material is and what its impact is in terms of escaping into the air? are you talking about the snow or something else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 are you talking about the snow or something else? maybe was it snowing there yesterday? I did not catch that....could only see it on the zoom so perhaps that explains it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 maybe was it snowing there yesterday? I did not catch that....could only see it on the zoom so perhaps that explains it.... yes they've had a lot of snow showers off and on at the plant the past week and more is expected in the coming days. they even "suspended operations" one day due to "snow"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyewall Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What would 10,000x normal levsl convert to in Sv? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What would 10,000x normal levsl convert to in Sv? Sounds like a good OSU question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott747 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What would 10,000x normal levsl convert to in Sv? Can't say this would be a correct conversion but might be in the ballpark. TOKYO, March 25, Kyodo Two of the three workers who were exposed to high-level radiation and sustained possible burns at a crisis-hit nuclear power plant in Fukushima Prefecture have likely suffered ''internal exposure'' in which radioactive substances have entered their bodies, but they are not showing early symptoms and do not require treatment, a national radiation research center said Friday. The National Institute of Radiological Sciences, where the three arrived earlier in the day for highly specialized treatment, said the two were exposed to 2 to 6 sieverts of radiation below their ankles, whereas exposure to 250 millisieverts is the limit set for workers dealing with the ongoing crisis, the worst in Japan's history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSUmetstud Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Sounds like a good OSU question I wouldn't know what the normal radiation is in water in the turbine building. Didn't they report 400 or 500 mSV/hr in the water? Those workers received 170-180 mSV and only got exposed hardcore on their feet...they're lucky it wasn't all over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j24vt Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Sounds like a good OSU question "The company says 3.9 million becquerels of radioactive substances per cubic centimeter were detected in the water that the workers were standing in. That is 10,000 times higher than levels of the water inside a nuclear reactor in operation." From here: http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/25_10.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyewall Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSUmetstud Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 "The company says 3.9 million becquerels of radioactive substances per cubic centimeter were detected in the water that the workers were standing in. That is 10,000 times higher than levels of the water inside a nuclear reactor in operation." From here: http://www3.nhk.or.j...lish/25_10.html damn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 damn dam crap **** all work..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LithiaWx Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What would 10,000x normal levsl convert to in Sv? not sure but the wording of 10,000x normal levels is fear mongering. It might be bad but if they had just quantified it into a Sv number like you said it would have been better. 10,000x times very little(normal), may not be that bad. I'm not saying that it's peaches and cream over there but to throw out a number like 10,000x worse is a tad much imo. A simple quantifiable number would have been best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoMo Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 What does your comment above mean? What is the impact? Latest on that from Kyodo: http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/81131.html Pools of water that may have seeped from either the reactor cores or spent fuel pools were also found in the turbine buildings of the No. 2 and No. 4 reactors, measuring up to 1 meter and 80 centimeters deep, respectively, while those near the No. 1 and No. 3 reactors were up to 40 cm and 1.5 cm deep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSUmetstud Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 not sure but the wording of 10,000x normal levels is fear mongering. It might be bad but if they had just quantified it into a Sv number like you said it would have been better. 10,000x times very little(normal), may not be that bad. I'm not saying that it's peaches and cream over there but to throw out a number like 10,000x worse is a tad much imo. A simple quantifiable number would have been best. umm...the article clarifies and says 10,000 times the normal water inside the reactor..which is already quite radioactive...this is not just the 10,000 times the normal meager atmospheric radiation around the plant... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunny and Warm Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Latest on that from Kyodo: http://english.kyodo...1/03/81131.html Pools of water that may have seeped from either the reactor cores or spent fuel pools were also found in the turbine buildings of the No. 2 and No. 4 reactors, measuring up to 1 meter and 80 centimeters deep, respectively, while those near the No. 1 and No. 3 reactors were up to 40 cm and 1.5 cm deep. thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott747 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 I know the biggest concern initially when it came to the fuel pools was the one a #4 after the comments from Jaczko. Based on all the snippets and actions that they continue to undertake I think it's the fuel pool at the #3 reactor that is generating the most problems and is the other source they are looking at that contributed to the workers exposure. The latest is they continue to pour/spray massive amounts of water onto the #3 fuel pool suggesting that there is a major leak.... The msm is going all bonkers about the latest so called 'breach' in the #3 containment system but as noted there has always been suspicions of some kind of breach in all three reactors. *edit* Detailed look at the reactors and issues - http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/english/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LithiaWx Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 umm...the article clarifies and says 10,000 times the normal water inside the reactor..which is already quite radioactive...this is not just the 10,000 times the normal meager atmospheric radiation around the plant... imo that's even more reason to just give a number to it. I seriously doubt many people know what's a normal radation level in water circulationg through a reactor. I know they gave the number in becquerels, imo they could have stopped there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janetjanet998 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 umm...the article clarifies and says 10,000 times the normal water inside the reactor..which is already quite radioactive...this is not just the 10,000 times the normal meager atmospheric radiation around the plant... I am really confused..haven't been following it that closely..I heard 10,000 above the normal level...but its 10,000 times above the normal level in the reactor!!!! wow but is this something new that just happened or something that could of always been there but they are just discovering it? If it is something new then what is causing it...the plant has been shut down for 2 weeks now..so the cores are no longer active...more less just new spent fuel? Is the containment weakening over time? Is there somehow still fission going on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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