Who gets more snow?

[gkrangers]

Holmdel, NJ or Lyndhurst, NJ?

[rgwp96]

lyndhurst by probably 5-10 inches

[green tube]

i'd bet....

holmdel ave: 24"

lyndhurst ave: 27"

[gkrangers]

Thinking about moving up that way, probably would be a bit better for snow.

[Isotherm]

Holmdel, NJ or Lyndhurst, NJ?

Neither. If you're going to move you should go more W, like Morris or Passaic counties. We average about the same as Lyndhurst, around 28".

[CooL]

Rutherford

[Isotherm]

There is no way in the world a town in Monmouth County averages the same amount of snow as a town in Bergen County...and Holmdel is far from the snowiest spot in Monmouth... the crazy 1980's nonwithstanding...

Most of Bergen County I'll give you, but Lyndhurst isn't that far from NYC, and their average is about 28" (NYC). We average about the same. So maybe they're 2" higher - that's still not something I'd move over. It'd probably take me at least a 10" difference in average to make the decision. I've lived in Monmouth county my whole life and can say I've rarely seen Lyndhurst do much better than us. Usually our crappy/good snow years coincide. BTW, my average was 33.7" for the 2000s here, which helped a good deal.

[Isotherm]

How does Monmouth County average 28"? Perhaps in the NW section of the county, but Holmdel is a short drive from Sandy Hook and Sandy Hook is not as snowy as JFK which has close to a 24" average.

I agree Central Park is about 4" snowier than JFK and being several miles to the NW, tacking on 2" to Lyndhurst seems reasonable.

I wouldn't call it a short drive. About a 35 minute car ride at best, and parts of the town are 11-13 miles inland, which makes a significant difference in most events. The only town west of Holmdel is Marlboro, then you've got Old Bridge in Middlesex county (which is about half the distance as Sandy Hook).

I'm sure you'd know from living on LI how much a 10-12 mile drive away from the ocean does to your snow totals.

[Isotherm]

How does Monmouth County average 28"? Perhaps in the NW section of the county, but Holmdel is a short drive from Sandy Hook and Sandy Hook is not as snowy as JFK which has close to a 24" average.

I agree Central Park is about 4" snowier than JFK and being several miles to the NW, tacking on 2" to Lyndhurst seems reasonable.

Also, Sandy Hook is essentially surrounded by water, compared to Holmdel which has a largely continental climate. That water influence makes a world's difference w/ mixing in winter storms. And just to clarify, I'm saying locations 10+ miles inland average 28". The immediate coast of Monmouth averages about 23-25".

[NorthShoreWx]

But I'm not going to suddenly think L.I. is as snowy as Boston

Orient > Jay Peak

[BlueSkiesFading]

Holmdel, NJ or Lyndhurst, NJ?

Hey, if you have any questions about the area just P.M. me. I'd be more than glad to help. I was shocked when I opened this thread and saw someone mention Lyndhurst considering the town is only about 1 sq mile big. Having lived here 22 out of my 28 years (the other 6 years I lived down in Brick), I think it's safe to say you'll see a little more snow on average then you would in Holmdel. We're only about 8 miles or so WNW of NYC, but in some winters that makes all the difference in the world. I'd say we average close to 30" a year, but I don't have any hard evidence to back that up.

[NJwinter23]

How does Monmouth County average 28"? Perhaps in the NW section of the county, but Holmdel is a short drive from Sandy Hook and Sandy Hook is not as snowy as JFK which has close to a 24" average.

I agree Central Park is about 4" snowier than JFK and being several miles to the NW, tacking on 2" to Lyndhurst seems reasonable.

Lyndhurst's latitude would make the difference in some events to Holmdel, otherwise it is a stones throw from the Meadowlands and probably the least snowy location in Bergen county. Holmdel, depending where you live (it is an 18 sq. mile town) is anywhere from 15 minutes due west to 30 minutes SW of Sandy Hook. Also, I'd argue it is one of the snowiest locations in Monmouth county because it is more towards the NW and a good part of town has hills ranging 200-400 ft. in elevation. The difference between a station like Belmar can be astronomical in winter storms. With that said, you are just about correct in saying Holmdel averages 24-25" and Lyndhurst is like Newark and probably around 28"

[nzucker]

Hey, I have no doubt the 80's were great in Monmouth...I'm even willing to believe an isolated spot here and there saw nearly the 5 feet Isotherm claimed during '86-'87..but over the long haul, the central NJ coast is not as snowy as the south shore of NYC, anbd I frankly have some doubt about most of the rest of the county, with the exception of the extreme NW, being as snowy as Central Park. The New Bruswick data is from Middlesex County...

Do you think it might be a question of UHI in the southern areas of NYC, or the fact that Isotherm lives on a hill perhaps?

Some people have questioned my measurements here in Westchester; although I normally report totals close to spotter reports, I sometimes get significantly more. The February 26, 2010 storm was one example of this...I already had 10" when most of the county was still seeing mixing and only a few sloppy inches on the ground. I live at 350' elevation far away from the Hudson River and LI Sound, in a mostly wooded area that's not typical of the region. I wonder if microclimates could be at play here in this question as well....

[gkrangers]

Glad to see I've created controversy.

Not exactly moving for the snow, but figured being a bit further north and west could hold slight benefit under some circumstances.

[rgwp96]

Glad to see I've created controversy.

Not exactly moving for the snow, but figured being a bit further north and west could hold slight benefit under some circumstances.

move 15 miles further west and maybe it will be worth it

[Isotherm]

He lives in Colts Neck which has an elevation of 75 feet. His 28" average for Monmouth is based on the New Brunswick record in nearby Middlesex County (I think). The 28" sounds believable for the extreme NW tip of Monmouth. The county is basically flat, coastal and south of NYC. Even if it had a 1000 ft mountain, it wouldn't help much when the 850 MB 0 C isotherm passed to its north, well before even reaching Staten Island.

As I said earlier, just good old fashioned climatology argues that the county is less snowy than areas off to the north.

As for Dobbs Ferry, they have a coop observer and I'm not sure if his totals were quite in line with your own, though he may have some missing data....

It's unfortunate we don't have a decent COOP around here, b/c the difference between New Brunswick and NW Monmouth is virtually nil. Colts Neck is about 75ft in the eastern third, but most of the town is 100ft or higher, with hills up to 200-230ft in the south (near Earle) and NW part of the town.

Somerville has an average of 28", and they're about 20 air miles NW of New Brunswick. So their average is essentially the same. If you think I average around 25", then you must think the coast of Monmouth averages about the same as Philly (19-20"), because the difference between here and Spring Lake/Asbury Park has been about 7-10" since 2000. Believe what you want, but I'd say I know the climo of my own local area better than you, and you know the climo of LI certainly better than me.

[rgwp96]

It's unfortunate we don't have a decent COOP around here, b/c the difference between New Brunswick and NW Monmouth is virtually nil. Colts Neck is about 75ft in the eastern third, but most of the town is 100ft or higher, with hills up to 200-230ft in the south (near Earle) and NW part of the town.

Somerville has an average of 28", and they're about 20 air miles NW of New Brunswick. So their average is essentially the same. If you think I average around 25", then you must think the coast of Monmouth averages about the same as Philly (19-20"), because the difference between here and Spring Lake/Asbury Park has been about 7-10" since 2000. Believe what you want, but I'd say I know the climo of my own local area better than you, and you know the climo of LI certainly better than me.

not going against you Tom but you are only 20 correct? At the most you have been paying attention to weather for what 6 yrs topps? Its to small of a sample size. Unless those stations are first order stations i wouldnt trust them. They always seem to be lacking data or take measurements only once a day and that severely impacts snow depth and snow falls . I cant say for certain what lyndhurst avgs but im sure their have been many times they were snow why you were a mix. Thats why i say they avg at least 5 more a year than you but in the grand scheme of things 5 inches is nothing

[Absolute Humidity]

Iv'e lived in Monmouth Co most of my 42yrs. and have noticed that yes, the rain/sleet line often sets up to our north, south of Lyndhurst, but.... but, I v'e also noticed many ocean enhanced storms jackpot Monmouth county while leaving places like NYC/Lyndhurst high and dry depending on the exact wind direction from the NE or ENE with ample cold air combine with North and Western Monmouth's 100 - 250' elevation. So I tend to agree that in the big picture, the averages are about the same + or - 3", but with no real COOP here, this could be debated indefinately as I for one also believe Monmouth could be on the +3" side of Lyndhurst.

[Isotherm]

Iv'e lived in Monmouth Co most of my 42yrs. and have noticed that yes, the rain/sleet line often sets up to our north, south of Lyndhurst, but.... but, I v'e also noticed many ocean enhanced storms jackpot Monmouth county while leaving places like NYC/Lyndhurst high and dry depending on the exact wind direction from the NE or ENE with ample cold air combine with North and Western Monmouth's 100 - 250' elevation. So I tend to agree that in the big picture, the averages are about the same + or - 3", but with no real COOP here, this could be debated indefinately as I for one also believe Monmouth could be on the +3" side of Lyndhurst.

Thanks absolute humidity, it's nice to see someone else from Monmouth chime in. What you noted is an important aspect of winter events I forgot to mention -- the ocean enhanced/Miller B/norlun type events that tend to produce more snowfall around here than in NE NJ. Those definitely add up over time.

Ray, I'm 20 but have been following the weather basically since I was 10 (and have a surprisingly good memory of almost all events since then). WRT the stations - you're correct. Unfortunately the one for Freehold is useless as it has missing data every winter, so the average is inaccurate.

[Absolute Humidity]

You can't fight climatology...Ocean County is snowier than Atlantic County, Monmouth County is snowier than Ocean County, Nassau County is snowier than Monmouth County, Fairfield County is snowier than Nassau County, Norfolk in Litchfield County is snowier than Mt. Washington...

True... but Long Island is also surrounded by large bodies of water - I can't count the number of times LI was raining while Nothern Ocean and Monmouth were snowing.

[Sundog]

True... but Long Island is also surrounded by large bodies of water - I can't count the number of times LI was raining while Nothern Ocean and Monmouth were snowing.

I don't know man...large parts of Suffolk county average more than a lot of the tri state area does. They have more latitude and they jut out more to the east which allows them to participate in storms that we here would otherwise refer to as out to sea.

[Alpha5]

Without the Long Island Sound, I would average so much more snow each year

[MikeS]

move 15 miles further west and maybe it will be worth it

Wayne!

[Absolute Humidity]

I don't know man...large parts of Suffolk county average more than a lot of the tri state area does. They have more latitude and they jut out more to the east which allows them to participate in storms that we here would otherwise refer to as out to sea.

True to that as well, ala Mar 3 2009, Dec 19 2010 - we both did well from those, Suffolk doing a bit better. Just hope we all can get a few good plowables this winter.

[Absolute Humidity]

Thanks absolute humidity, it's nice to see someone else from Monmouth chime in. What you noted is an important aspect of winter events I forgot to mention -- the ocean enhanced/Miller B/norlun type events that tend to produce more snowfall around here than in NE NJ. Those definitely add up over time.

Ray, I'm 20 but have been following the weather basically since I was 10 (and have a surprisingly good memory of almost all events since then). WRT the stations - you're correct. Unfortunately the one for Freehold is useless as it has missing data every winter, so the average is inaccurate.

No Problem, we basically avg the same each winter.

[MikeS]

Meh, I'd rather go to Oakland...@ 550 feet a.s.l. , it's like a poor man's West Milford, snow wise...

Yeah, I'm in Wayne (at about 380ft ASL) near Oakland and they definitely do a bit better.

[Absolute Humidity]

Ohh, nice Monmouth/N.Ocean -vs- Lyndhurst 00Z GFS, 10 day fantasy storm, well not so fantasy, its progged for DEC 5 & 6th.

[gkrangers]

Ohh, nice Monmouth/N.Ocean -vs- Lyndhurst 00Z GFS, 10 day fantasy storm, well not so fantasy, its progged for DEC 5 & 6th.

I won't move until after this storm.

[Allsnow]

Holmdel has the higest elevation in monmouth county, i lived there for 20 years. Have great tales of snow and enhancement off the ocean. In the spring snow storms we pretty much clean-up, while a short drive down to hazlet its a slushy mess. I would go holmdel for snow and lifestyle over alot of towns. The occurance of a 12/19/08 where up north gets a few more sloppy inches, i would take my chances with.

[ORH_wxman]

Poor old William, he's almost 83 years old and no one ever takes his side... has one foot in the grave and another on a banana peel...

Its natural for most people on a board dominated by snow lovers to "defend" their local climo to a position of as much snow as possible. I am prone to it as well.

However, barring any major elevation swings (>500 feet), obvious proximity to water, and no orographic effects to the east (potential downslope), latitude almost always ends up winning I've found.