I need a 'second'' for my motion that the PSUHoffman Storm be deemed a "HECS".

[AdamHLG]

I am making a motion that this Board commonly accept the PSUHoffman Storm as a "HECS" and not a "MECS" for BALTIMORE-DC-VA. I would like a 'second' to my motion and if it is given discussion can ensue. For the stand of time, when looking back over the next 20 years, it shall be thus defined.

In support of my motion, the change over occured at 5:00 pm in the Baltimore area and it was done at 10:00 pm. That is 5 hours. That is what makes this one special. What happened during that relatively short period of time? In the Chestnut Ridge area of Baltimore County, we received 11 inches. So that's more than 2" / hr +. For 5 straight hours. And there was wind. And there was green lightning. GREEN lightning. This storm will be remembered for its thundersnow... its green lightning thundersnow .

But most of all this storm will be remembered for its impact on rush hour traffic - and folks the rush hour is still going as I write this at 4 am. I am a volly EMS Lt. in the FD and we alone ran 8 calls for the Engine and 10+ separate calls for the Medic (which is still running calls as I type this). These calls started at 5:30 and its now 4 am. There are cars stuck EVERYWARE. Abandon. Stuck. Stuck in place. It was not only during the insane SN++ rates. When it ended, everyone hit the roads thinking what happened out there was 'nothing''. It was only 5 hours. How bad could it have been? Time to go home from work at 10 PM. That rain that fell first? It didnt evaporate. It froze under the 11". And the high mosture content to the snow then itself froze. Everything that was moving is now stuck..

It is very much like what happened in NYC in December from a rush hour mpact perspective. Besides, all our big storms are normally on weekends, right? This was a rush hour special. It was a HECS.

I submit to you that this two-inch an hour wind blown green lightning rush hour storm should qualify as a HECS.

Adam

[North Balti Zen]

Nope. But it was really fun.

[bluefish1]

I am making a motion that this Board commonly accept the PSUHoffman Storm as a "HECS" and not a "MECS" for BALTIMORE-DC-VA. I would like a 'second' to my motion and if it is given discussion can ensue. For the stand of time, when looking back over the next 20 years, it shall be thus defined.

In support of my motion, the change over occured at 5:00 pm in the Baltimore area and it was done at 10:00 pm. That is 5 hours. That is what makes this one special. What happened during that relatively short period of time? In the Chestnut Ridge area of Baltimore County, we received 11 inches. So that's more than 2" / hr +. For 5 straight hours. And there was wind. And there was green lightning. GREEN lightning. This storm will be remembered for its thundersnow... its green lightning thundersnow .

But most of all this storm will be remembered for its impact on rush hour traffic - and folks the rush hour is still going as I write this at 4 am. I am a volly EMS Lt. in the FD and we alone ran 8 calls for the Engine and 10+ separate calls for the Medic (which is still running calls as I type this). These calls started at 5:30 and its now 4 am. There are cars stuck EVERYWARE. Abandon. Stuck. Stuck in place. It was not only during the insane SN++ rates. When it ended, everyone hit the roads thinking what happened out there was 'nothing''. It was only 5 hours. How bad could it have been? Time to go home from work at 10 PM. That rain that fell first? It didnt evaporate. It froze under the 11". And the high mosture content to the snow then itself froze. Everything that was moving is now stuck..

It is very much like what happened in NYC in December from a rush hour mpact perspective. Besides, all our big storms are normally on weekends, right? This was a rush hour special. It was a HECS.

I submit to you that this two-inch an hour wind blown green lightning rush hour storm should qualify as a HECS.

Adam

It was one of the most unusual events I've seen in NOVA, snow to rain to HEAVY sleet to thunder ice and snow and near white out for hours last night. Now there's 8-10" in my yard. Not the biggest accumulation I've seen here, but I would say the most interesting storm. I vote YES for HECS for the area.

No question about HECS north of us in the Tristate area--they broke all kinds of records.

[Symblized]

I think the term HECS gets thrown around way too much. Not everything can be a HECS. Historic means truly historic for much of the East Coast. Meaning you'd rank this up there with the Blizzard of 96, PDIII, the Superstorm of 1993, the Knickerbocker storm, the Blizzard of 1899... there are really very few true HECS.The rates last night were pretty heavy, but there's only a relatively thin stripe of 10" + snow throughout the area and NE through NYC (with some 15-20" reports NJ through CT). A big storm, and possibly with an okay NESIS rating, but I wouldn't rank this anywhere near those few storms.

http://www.ncdc.noaa...d-ice/nesis.php

http://www.ncdc.noaa...n-uccellini.pdf

[winter_warlock]

I am making a motion that this Board commonly accept the PSUHoffman Storm as a "HECS" and not a "MECS" for BALTIMORE-DC-VA. I would like a 'second' to my motion and if it is given discussion can ensue. For the stand of time, when looking back over the next 20 years, it shall be thus defined.

In support of my motion, the change over occured at 5:00 pm in the Baltimore area and it was done at 10:00 pm. That is 5 hours. That is what makes this one special. What happened during that relatively short period of time? In the Chestnut Ridge area of Baltimore County, we received 11 inches. So that's more than 2" / hr +. For 5 straight hours. And there was wind. And there was green lightning. GREEN lightning. This storm will be remembered for its thundersnow... its green lightning thundersnow .

But most of all this storm will be remembered for its impact on rush hour traffic - and folks the rush hour is still going as I write this at 4 am. I am a volly EMS Lt. in the FD and we alone ran 8 calls for the Engine and 10+ separate calls for the Medic (which is still running calls as I type this). These calls started at 5:30 and its now 4 am. There are cars stuck EVERYWARE. Abandon. Stuck. Stuck in place. It was not only during the insane SN++ rates. When it ended, everyone hit the roads thinking what happened out there was 'nothing''. It was only 5 hours. How bad could it have been? Time to go home from work at 10 PM. That rain that fell first? It didnt evaporate. It froze under the 11". And the high mosture content to the snow then itself froze. Everything that was moving is now stuck..

It is very much like what happened in NYC in December from a rush hour mpact perspective. Besides, all our big storms are normally on weekends, right? This was a rush hour special. It was a HECS.

I submit to you that this two-inch an hour wind blown green lightning rush hour storm should qualify as a HECS.

Adam

was a nice storm, but a 6-12 inch snowfall is not historic

[FrederickWX]

The two February storms from last winter were historic. When comparing this storm to those however, they don't really compare. I think this one can be classified as a MECS, but I would vote against labeling this an HECS.

[SomeguyfromTakomaPark]

No chance. Not for DC at least. Yeah it was a great 3-4 hour period here, but c'mon now.

[TowsonWeather]

The two February storms from last winter were historic. When comparing this storm to those however, they don't really compare. I think this one can be classified as a MECS, but I would vote against labeling this an HECS.

I got about 2 inches less snow from this storm than I did from the second storm last February - and I got it in a relatively short amount of time.

I was out in that storm last feb and I was out in this storm, and up here in Towson at least, the dynamics were very similar. The conditions last night were extreme for several hours - I couldn't even walk up my street into the wind without goggles; the snow was blinding.

For us here at least, 13 inches of heavy wet snow coming in sideways on a howling wind makes for a HECS. These don't happen all that often around here.

(not to mention the frequent lightning and booming thunder that I heard on and off for almost 4 hours)

[nw baltimore wx]

One of my all-time favorite storms, but not historical.

[bigsurmark]

Not a HECS, but definitely a "Memorable" East Coast Storm!

[clskinsfan]

Not even close to a HECS. But for 2 hours it had some of the heaviest snow i have ever seen in my life.

[Fozz]

This wasn't a HECS anywhere in the area. This storm simply doesn't compare to February 2010 or PDII or January 1996. It compares to what SNE got on 12/9/05 and what DC got in November 1987.

[TowsonWeather]

This wasn't a HECS anywhere in the area. This storm simply doesn't compare to February 2010 or PDII or January 1996. It compares to what SNE got on 12/9/05 and what DC got in November 1987.

Yeah again, it actually does compare to the second February storm for some of us.

I can't speak for everyone of course, and I'm not suggesting that it should make any kind of list or get any kind of official "HECS" label - just saying that comparisons to other historic storms are not outlandish.

13 inches of soaking wet heavy snow - most of it in a blinding 5-hour period accompanied by howling winds, thunder and lightning? That's a really big deal anywhere in Central MD.

[Ian]

it was clear rush hour would be a massive issue. i told people at work the day before to think about what happened in nyc on a lesser scale. there were a lot of bad forecasts out there unfortunetely.

around here this was a secs imo.

[Fozz]

Yeah again, it actually does compare to the second February storm for some of us.

I can't speak for everyone of course, and I'm not suggesting that it should make any kind of list or get any kind of official "HECS" label - just saying that comparisons to other historic storms are not outlandish.

13 inches of soaking wet heavy snow - most of it in a blinding 5-hour period accompanied by howling winds, thunder and lightning? That's a really big deal anywhere in Central MD.

Just because your backyard got a similar total compared to Feb 10, 2010, doesn't mean it is comparable to that storm as a whole, or can be called a HECS.

13-15" of snow ain't a HECS total anyway.

[TowsonWeather]

around here this was a secs imo.

I agree completely on SECS. Like I said, I'm not trying to lobby for this to be seen as a HECS (not that any of the labeling matters anyway), was just responding to the (imo incorrect) assertion that "This wasn't a HECS anywhere in the area."

Because for some of us, it certainly was.

[Fozz]

I agree completely on SECS. Like I said, I'm not trying to lobby for this to be seen as a HECS (not that any of the labeling matters anyway), was just responding to the (imo incorrect) assertion that "This wasn't a HECS anywhere in the area."

Because for some of us, it certainly was.

Learn your climo. A HECS is 18"+ if you live around Baltimore.

[TowsonWeather]

Just because your backyard got a similar total compared to Feb 10, 2010, doesn't mean it is comparable to that storm as a whole, or can be called a HECS.

13-15" of snow ain't a HECS total anyway.

1. I didn't say that it was "comparable to that storm as a whole". I said for ME, here, IMBY, the impact was the same. And it wasn't just the totals, as I have made clear.

2. I specifically said that I wasn't suggesting it can or should be called a HECS. More than once.

3. Yes, actually, 13-15' IS a HECS total. What prevents this from being a HECS is that those higher totals were fairly limited geographically speaking. If this region got a widespread 13-15", that is a HECS - and suggesting otherwise is silliness.

[Ian]

I agree completely on SECS. Like I said, I'm not trying to lobby for this to be seen as a HECS (not that any of the labeling matters anyway), was just responding to the (imo incorrect) assertion that "This wasn't a HECS anywhere in the area."

Because for some of us, it certainly was.

it was maybe a historic few hour period.. or at least one you don't get very often. but the accumulation around here was just about a once a year or every two year event depending on location. if you factor in what happened north i guess it could be a low end mecs for the east coast as a whole.

[TowsonWeather]

Learn your climo. A HECS is 18"+ if you live around Baltimore.

I've lived here all my life. I know my "climo".

And again, 13-15" is a HECS in central MD. Sorry bud.

[Symblized]

There's a complete difference between a Historic East Coast Snowstorm and Historic IMBY Snowstorm. You simply can't say you have a HECS "around here." No such thing. You can have a historic storm for Baltimore or DC or MoCo or whatever proper, but it's not gonna be a HECS even if you got 30" if nobody else got diddly.

[Ian]

And again, 13-15" is a HECS in central MD. Sorry bud.

no it's not

[TowsonWeather]

it was maybe a historic few hour period.. or at least one you don't get very often. but the accumulation around here was just about a once a year or every two year event depending on location. if you factor in what happened north i guess it could be a low end mecs for the east coast as a whole.

I'll be pretty interested to see what the NESIS rating is for this. With all of our focus down here, I didn't realize just how much this hammered the Upper MA and NE, too. Fun stuff.

[Fozz]

I've lived here all my life. I know my "climo".

And again, 13-15" is a HECS in central MD. Sorry bud.

13-15" is not a HECS in central MD, and should not be in the same category as storms that bring 25-30".

Look at Baltimore's top 10 snowstorms.......not a single storm in the top 10 had less than 18".

[TowsonWeather]

There's a complete difference between a Historic East Coast Snowstorm and Historic IMBY Snowstorm. You simply can't say you have a HECS "around here." No such thing. You can have a historic storm for Baltimore or DC or MoCo or whatever proper, but it's not gonna be a HECS even if you got 30" if nobody else got diddly.

Did you actually read what I wrote?

I understand that - and specifically said that I am NOT suggesting this is a HECS. Sheesh.

[Ian]

There's a complete difference between a Historic East Coast Snowstorm and Historic IMBY Snowstorm. You simply can't say you have a HECS "around here." No such thing. You can have a historic storm for Baltimore or DC or MoCo or whatever proper, but it's not gonna be a HECS even if you got 30" if nobody else got diddly.

the whole classification is made up so the argument is silly

[Symblized]

it was maybe a historic few hour period.. or at least one you don't get very often. but the accumulation around here was just about a once a year or every two year event depending on location. if you factor in what happened north i guess it could be a low end mecs for the east coast as a whole.

Agreed. We shall see how the NESIS ranking ends up.

As to your later post, I understand what you're saying, but if you're going to use a term/classification like HECS anyway, even if it's made up, at least know what it means/stands for. (I know you do)

[gymengineer]

I'll be pretty interested to see what the NESIS rating is for this. With all of our focus down here, I didn't realize just how much this hammered the Upper MA and NE, too. Fun stuff.

15" at KPHL and 19" at KNYC. This is certainly going to get a NESIS rating. NYC, like DC last winter, has now had two top-ten snowstorms in one season.

[Symblized]

Did you actually read what I wrote?

I understand that - and specifically said that I am NOT suggesting this is a HECS. Sheesh.

Haha chill out bud it's cool. I'm not talking to you, just making a general argument. If I was, I would have made this a reply, rather than a standalone post. Sensitive much?

[Chris L]

After last season, I agree with the other posters that you need to see at least 17-18 plus widespread to be a HECS.