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December Forecast Discussion


REDMK6GLI

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Ignore 0z GFS for dec 21 event. The model's sh!tty resolution "looses" the big low over se canada so the HIGH slides east and the low goes into ohio. Other models with better resolution dont do this... Including the 13km GFS

Whatever

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Ignore 0z GFS for dec 21 event. The model's sh!tty resolution "looses" the big low over se canada so the HIGH slides east and the low goes into ohio. Other models with better resolution dont do this... Including the 13km GFS

 

Euro tonight looks a little to south and east tonight ..though do not have the precipitation images to confirm with certainty..

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Euro tonight looks a little to south and east tonight ..though do not have the precipitation images to confirm with certainty..

Correct. Light precip .05-.10" to roughly EPA.

Nice little set up to bring in some fresh cold air for what's behind it.

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Whatever

Some of you have to understand why private forecasters use the euro 1st .When you are paid based on performance and are not a salaried based employee its only reasonable that you rely on the number 1 skill score model in the industry .

The GFS is really not the model of choice when your bills and reputation depend on being successful as a results oriented entrepreneur.

When your point and click bust by 15 degrees from 5 days out

or a foot of party cloudy falls after a week of the model taking your snowstorm south and east of NYC you just move on but watch a NG trader miss the draw because you had a blow out like that and It would be line out.

The GFS is the number 3 skill score model of all the globals and those who are fans of it usually just sit around and wait for it to play catch up as its missed many big event on the EC over the past decade.

I know there are fans of it and it's not a put down to NCEP which has a deep product base. But it does lag behind the Euro and UKMET in verified scoring So whatever doesn't necessarily fit here.

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One bad euro run come on man!!

 

The OP Euro has been having a different solution every run. So the Euro hasn't locked into a solution yet as

you see the wide spread between the OP and Ensemble. When the OP and ensemble come into better

agreement we'll have a clear picture of the second storm. But the first low can suppress the second

too much if it trends less progressive. Just remember that one-two storms need to be perfect for the

second to work out with no solid blocking. Zero margin for error without a Davis Strait/Greenland block.

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The OP Euro has been having a different solution every run. So the Euro hasn't locked into a solution yet as

you see the wide spread between the OP and Ensemble. When the OP and ensemble come into better

agreement we'll have a clear picture of the second storm. But the first low can suppress the second

too much if it trends less progressive. Just remember that one-two storms need to be perfect for the

second to work out with no solid blocking. Zero margin for error without a Davis Strait/Greenland block.

Strongly agree here chris, commom rule of thumb here is when the ECMWF OP & ENSEMBLES are almost the same you can pretty much take it to the bank. Currently it has having problems with the christmas eve threat and the storms preceeding it. However, this is the ECMWF and i dont think it will be long for it to lock onto to what would be the eventual solution. ECMWF makes its reputation off southern stream systems so i dont expect its subpar performance to continue much longer honestly

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Strongly agree here chris, commom rule of thumb here is when the ECMWF OP & ENSEMBLES are almost the same you can pretty much take it to the bank. Currently it has having problems with the christmas eve threat and the storms preceeding it. However, this is the ECMWF and i dont think it will be long for it to lock onto to what would be the eventual solution. ECMWF makes its reputation off southern stream systems so i dont expect its subpar performance to continue much longer honestly

 

The UKMET is also slower and more amped with the first low. So it may be that the models are beginning to see that

will be a big player as to the teleconnections for the second storm. It always makes me a bit nervous to

rely on the first low to be the perfect 50/50 for the second low when there is no solid Davis Strait

or Greenland blocking pattern before or during the event.

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The UKMET is also slower and more amped with the first low. So it may be that the models are beginning to see that

will be a big player as to the teleconnections for the second storm. It always makes me a bit nervous to

rely on the first low to be the perfect 50/50 for the second low when there is no solid Davis Strait

or Greenland blocking pattern before or during the event.

Hence why before we get established a west based -NAO we will have to "thread the needle". We have seen even the past several years what a well placed/time 50/50 LP has done in a crappy pattern for us snow wise on the EC. still going for a 4"+ event for NYC before this month is up

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 If any bothered to read DT s piece he was as cautious as he said  he was not completely sold on the 21st , because he wasn't sure if the 17th system could create the block or if the 21st ejects fast enough to catch it on its way E then NE .

 

You will see different solutions off the OP because as many of should know by now the Euro is traditionally slow ejecting  SWs out of the SW and the speed of it will determine if it can actually catch the block on the backside . That solution will take a few days but the GFS is not the model that will find that because it`s just flat out awful .

I did not make those skill scores up in my basement either .

 

If it doesn`t DT thought the 21st could create the block for the 25 th .

 

There are  3 SW swinging through under a pos PNA  this is not 1 and done so threading the needle will come down to where the trough axis sets up , the speed of the SW and can we catch a transient block .

 

Patience is the key . We said the pattern would look better starting Dec 20 . I think the Euro ensembles are showing you that .

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Mets like DT dont use just the models.  Lets see if his skill is what he says it is.  I have faith.

 

Otherwise it doesn't take much to draw some black lines and sound educated.  But again, I dont think thats the case,   I think he is going to school everyone.  As they say, that's why they play the game.

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the ao/nao forecasts have been useless...every day it changes...The nao is very positive and it is forecast to fall towards neutral or negative territory...The ao is positive today and is forecast to be above to neutral now...Tomorrow it will probably change...If I was a real met and made a living from it I would be pulling my hair out...What's ever left of it... :axe:

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Patience is the key . We said the pattern would look better starting Dec 20 . I think the Euro ensembles are showing you that .

PB

 

 the key

may not fit the pattern lock   LOL

 

200mb GEFS  guidance

 

 

 

 

http://mag.ncep.noaa.gov/model-guidance-model-parameter.php?group=Model%20Guidance&model=gefs-spag&area=npac&cycle=20141213%2006%20UTC&param=200_1176_ht&fourpan=no&imageSize=&ps=area

 

Flatline EKG FTW

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the ao/nao forecasts have been useless...every day it changes...The nao is very positive and it is forecast to fall towards neutral or negative territory...The ao is positive today and is forecast to be above to neutral now...Tomorrow it will probably change...If I was a real met and made a living from it I would be pulling my hair out...What's ever left of it... :axe:

 

None have the runs have had anything more than a transient or weak -AO/-NAO and there is the problem.

El Nino Decembers typically don't have much blocking. 2002 and 2009 were the outlier El Nino years that

really spoiled a lot of people.

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